| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 15:28:06
|
After the destruction of Mulhorand by the Spellplague, the Mulhorandi pantheon disappeared. Where are they now?
In the novel Unclean, there's a brief mention of Horus-Re and his shattered temple in Delhumide. Such small place still exudes the lingering power of Horus-Re, which is anathema to undead. So clearly, he's still around somewhere, able to extend a portion of his divine power to Toril.
|
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
Snowblood
Senior Scribe
Australia
388 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 15:43:23
|
maybe in Abier...and the incarnate mummies are still buried deep in the deserts their necropolis is still there and those guys still retain a divine spark I would guess
 |
Aryvandaar, Ilythiir, Arnothoi, Orva, Sarphil, Anauria/Asram/Hlondath, Uvaeren, Braceldaur, Ilodhar, Lisenaar, Imaskar, Miyeritar, Orishaar, Shantel Othrieir, Keltormir, Eaerlann, Ammarindar, Siluvanede, Sharrven, Illefarn, Ardeep, Rystal Wood, Evereska are all available here for download:http://phasai.deviantart.com/gallery/
|
Edited by - Snowblood on 25 Sep 2011 15:43:58 |
 |
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 15:47:32
|
So no recent write-up about them in the sourcebooks?
Other than Horus-Re, were the gods in the Mulhorandi pantheon ever mentioned in other 4E novels? Perhaps from such accounts we could conjecture on the most probable place they're at now. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 25 Sep 2011 15:48:46 |
|
|
|
Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 17:46:19
|
No. Nothing in the sourcebooks.
I dealt with what happened, from the mortal perspective, in a Musing I posted here.
From the divine perspective, the lands and people from which the Mulhorandi deities drew their power were transposed with the equivalent lands and people from Abeir. Assuming those deities survived at all, they would most likely have been swapped out into Abeir along with the people that disappeared. |
|
|
|
Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 18:37:32
|
I was under the impression, and I could be wrong, that Mulhorand was not one of the lands of Toril that was swapped with Abeir, but rather a slice of Abeir's topography materialized over Mulhorand and dropped down upon it, crushing it almost completely.
The plane of the Mulhorandi pantheon is no longer to be found in Faerūn's cosmology. From that I surmise that the Mulhorandi gods did not survive to maintain their plane.
It would be cool though, if one or more of the manifestations or incarnations of the Mulhorandi gods survived, buried deep beneath the stone and earth that covers one of their great pyramids.
If any of the gods have managed to survive, though, the belief that sustains them has dwindled to nigh unsustainable numbers. There are few Mulhorandi survivors, and of those Mulhorandi (perhaps some of them expats, traders, sailors and travelers who were out of the area when the catastrophe happened) who are still around, their faith must have surely been tested by it all. Many may have lost their faith or switched to other gods. (Amaunator seems to be a likely beneficiary of the disillusioned, former Mulhorandi faithful.) Lack of faith can be deadly to a god, and therefore, if they have survived, they may be hovering around divine rank 1 or even DVR 0. Their power levels would be very low.
An alternative theory is that when the Imaskari god barrier collapsed, the Mulhorandi gods all rejoined with their source deities back at wherever the homeplane of the Mulan gods is (probably Earth). It is possible that when the Spellplague happened, the Mulan godheads intervened to transport their remaining faithful back to their original homeworld. I kind of like that idea, that as this huge chunk of Abeir appeared in the air over Mulhorand like a giant piece of orange rind made of rock and sand, as it came plummeting down on their heads, a huge percentage of the population of Mulhorand disappeared in a great Mulhorandi rapture as they were teleported back to modern D&D Earth's Egypt.
Come to think of it, that would be a fun story in it's own right. Maybe that would be an interesting factor at play in the Arab Spring over on D&D Earth. |
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2011 : 19:48:58
|
Quite interesting, Garen and Gray! And that Musings thread, too. |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 04:11:27
|
I prefer to think that the Mulhorandi gods are in hiding, and they took a significant portion of their worshippers with them. 
|
Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
|
|
|
Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3286 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 04:16:20
|
They went to Deep Imaskar!!
Unless Deep Imaskar is a spellplague pocket... |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
Edited by - Brimstone on 26 Sep 2011 04:20:11 |
|
|
|
Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 04:31:10
|
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
They went to Deep Imaskar!!
Unless Deep Imaskar is a spellplague pocket...
Be that spellplague in yer pocket, or cereulean spheres? Either way, seems ye be happy t'see the lass! |
Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
|
|
|
sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 05:43:26
|
I wanted to say they were dead.
Bast is still active in the realms.
better known as Sharess though.
|
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 06:14:19
|
If Unclean is any indication, the Mulhorandi pantheon must be somewhere near, and are still "allowed" by Ao to extend their influence to Toril. Where their worshippers are now is yet another question that begs an answer. |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2011 : 23:58:53
|
| Doing a cheesy Reality Show? |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
|
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 00:12:55
|
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Doing a cheesy Reality Show?
Mulhorand's Got Talent  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 01:12:30
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Doing a cheesy Reality Show?
Mulhorand's Got Talent
I prefer "So You Think You Can Bellydance"
|
Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
|
|
|
skychrome
Senior Scribe
713 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 01:40:29
|
quote:
Originally posted by Therise
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Doing a cheesy Reality Show?
Mulhorand's Got Talent
I prefer "So You Think You Can Bellydance"
I heard they are now actors in Return of the Mummy XVII and 10.000 B.C. Reloaded... |
"You make an intriguing offer, one that is very tempting. It would seem that I have little alternative than to answer thusly: DISINTEGRATE!" Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick 625 |
|
|
|
Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 01:45:40
|
| Yeah I would say they are with Maztica and a few other places that are now on Abeir, and they are referred to as Returned-Toril over there. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 01:48:16
|
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Doing a cheesy Reality Show?
Mulhorandi Idol! |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 13:38:23
|
Could some or all of the Mulhorandi pantheon have "merged" with the Torilian deities of same portfolios? |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 14:30:02
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Could some or all of the Mulhorandi pantheon have "merged" with the Torilian deities of same portfolios?
Possible, but I'm inclined to doubt it. With most of the Mulhorandi people no longer on Toril, there's little reason for Toril's deities to want to merge with their Mulhorandi counterparts -- they simply won't get much out of the deal. It'd be like your independently-owned corner convenience store trying to merge with Wal-Mart -- what does Wal-Mart get out of the deal that makes it worthwhile? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 14:35:27
|
More power? |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 16:22:59
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
More power?
Well, their influence and worshipper-base wouldn't increase that much. It'd be a bad deal for the Mulhorandi deities, really.
Personally, I think they're just hanging out, deep underground, associated with hidden temples. They might be hanging on to their status as deities by a tiny thread, depending on how many active worshippers they still have.
|
Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 16:27:23
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Could some or all of the Mulhorandi pantheon have "merged" with the Torilian deities of same portfolios?
Possible, but I'm inclined to doubt it. With most of the Mulhorandi people no longer on Toril, there's little reason for Toril's deities to want to merge with their Mulhorandi counterparts -- they simply won't get much out of the deal. It'd be like your independently-owned corner convenience store trying to merge with Wal-Mart -- what does Wal-Mart get out of the deal that makes it worthwhile?
Agreed.
And besides, I'd imagine Ao would need to see the benefits for something like this before allowing it. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
|
|
|
Old Man Harpell
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2011 : 21:20:39
|
The FRCG (p.81) says that Sharess (who came to Toril with the other Egyptian Mulhorandi deities as Bast) is still listed as having influence over 'cats'. Wherever the other Mulhorand deities went, she stuck around as one of Sune's lackeys (exarchs). But as far as I'm aware, she's the only one.
- OMH |
Edited by - Old Man Harpell on 27 Sep 2011 21:26:23 |
|
|
|
MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2011 : 07:40:27
|
I consider material published in Planescape to be true so they would still exist and just not be present on Faerun because they have no worshipers. My computer hard drive died along with all my pdfs but I seem to recall that the God Kings were just small aspects of the larger multispheric Egyptian deities. Don't some Mulhorandi survivors in Gheldaneth still worship "the old gods". I can't read what it said but I think that entry would contain clues as to the canonical answer to this question.
In regards to Bast, the impression i've gotten (and I don't think there is an absolute answer) but the aspect of Bast on Toril became Sharess by merging with Zandilar... but Bast still had aspects on other worlds where she was worshiped.
In my own envisioning of the Realms the Mulhorandi pantheon would have merged with the Faerunian pantheon, with only the non-redundant deities staying. (Geb, Hathor, Anhur, and Set don't really have an obvious parallel in the larger Faerunian pantheon, to me. Also I like Seshat... )
I don't think "lackey" is a good word to describe exarchs, especially exarchs of freedom loving deities like Sune = P
The workings of the Gods are not for mortals to understand. |
|
|
|
Snowblood
Senior Scribe
Australia
388 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2011 : 10:39:11
|
| Don't forget about Sharess/Bastet...surely she is still floating around... |
Aryvandaar, Ilythiir, Arnothoi, Orva, Sarphil, Anauria/Asram/Hlondath, Uvaeren, Braceldaur, Ilodhar, Lisenaar, Imaskar, Miyeritar, Orishaar, Shantel Othrieir, Keltormir, Eaerlann, Ammarindar, Siluvanede, Sharrven, Illefarn, Ardeep, Rystal Wood, Evereska are all available here for download:http://phasai.deviantart.com/gallery/
|
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2011 : 10:48:53
|
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
The workings of the Gods are not for mortals to understand.
Unless the mortals we're talking about the very ones who write about and "decide" the fates of the gods. |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11701 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2011 : 13:25:13
|
Well, I'm not exactly enthused with Mulhorand and Unther's displacement. I found them more useful in their third edition form (to clarify though, Mulhorand more so than Unther, due to its interactions with Thay and its spreading influence in Unther). However, that being said, I don't want to open this up to a "complaining" session of fourth edition, especially since I don't play it and have fallen to just reading the novels now.
If I were to take up a campaign where the events that had happened in the 4th edition realms were present using 3rd edition rules, I'd definitely play up that prior to the spellplague Mulhorand finished securing Unther. I'd definitely also have the Mulhorandi people have gotten switched over to Abeir along with their pantheon. I'd then build out Abeir a little bit more as a more reptile/dragon/lizard/snake/dinosaur oriented world where humanity was little known. Then where "Thay" and "Aglarond" and "Thesk" are I'd put a powerful orc nation and hint that this is indeed where the orcs from the "Orcgate" came from (hinting that the followers of Thayd who opened the Orcgates using Imaskari lore had actually opened a portal to Abeir, and further hinting that possibly something to do with the Imaskari gates is WHY Mulhorand and Unther were the areas that swapped).
Then (without the books in front of me mind you) I'd say that the people in the Shaar south of Unther (who were also transposed with the genasi country) joined up with the people of the Empire of Mulhorand for protection. So, suddenly this powerful empire of humans shows up in the world, backed by the power of gods who want their worshippers to succeed. However, there are two deities who don't like the empire who also come over. Those deities are Set (lessee, a god of darkness & snakes in Abeir) and Sebek, goddess of Crocodiles (again, a deity of reptiles). These divine beings are actually embraced by SOME (not many) worshippers outside of the Mulhorandi pantheon. Also, the followers of Tiamat and Bahamut gain a greater following amongst the Abeiran dragonborn (both of whom were active in Unther).
I know some of the above would need work, but it could prove for an interesting short part of a campaign if the players suddenly find themselves in this other world. Maybe somehow they have to find a way back to Toril. Maybe they end up re-opening the orcgates and a flood of Orcs spills into this new undead filled Thay (just to make Szass Tam's day, you know).
Some may not like the idea of the Orcgates opening onto Abeir, and I kind of see you'd have to do a little bit of a workaround with it because it would somewhat imply that the Orc deities are present on Abeir. However, I don't have a problem with this, as I could easily see it that perhaps these Orcs are from a crash landed spelljamming vessel. Maybe Ao even let the Orc gods in only in a limited fashion like what he did to the Mulhorandi (such that maybe the Orc deities in Abeir are simply a immortal being living amongst their people, with "royal" orc manifestations present from amongst the families that the immortal bred with). This of course, would bring up further questions of "did the Imaskari barrier against the gods extend to both Toril and Abeir"? I know most would say no to this, but with the ways of magic... who knows.... after all, were Toril and Abeir technically part of the same Crystal Sphere after the separation, just out of phase with one another? Were they made into 2 distinct Crystal Spheres in the same universe but with some kind of link between them? |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
|
|
|
Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 08 Nov 2011 : 15:11:35
|
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Could some or all of the Mulhorandi pantheon have "merged" with the Torilian deities of same portfolios?
Possible, but I'm inclined to doubt it. With most of the Mulhorandi people no longer on Toril, there's little reason for Toril's deities to want to merge with their Mulhorandi counterparts -- they simply won't get much out of the deal. It'd be like your independently-owned corner convenience store trying to merge with Wal-Mart -- what does Wal-Mart get out of the deal that makes it worthwhile?
Agreed.
And besides, I'd imagine Ao would need to see the benefits for something like this before allowing it.
He allowed the Mulhorandi Pantheon to spread their influence during the time of fallen Imaskar without 'clear' benefits to him or his cause [whatever that is]. So I don't think he would not allow the merging of some Torilian deities with the Mulhorandi Pantheon just because he sees no benefits in it. |
Every beginning has an end. |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 08 Nov 2011 : 15:45:35
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Could some or all of the Mulhorandi pantheon have "merged" with the Torilian deities of same portfolios?
Possible, but I'm inclined to doubt it. With most of the Mulhorandi people no longer on Toril, there's little reason for Toril's deities to want to merge with their Mulhorandi counterparts -- they simply won't get much out of the deal. It'd be like your independently-owned corner convenience store trying to merge with Wal-Mart -- what does Wal-Mart get out of the deal that makes it worthwhile?
Agreed.
And besides, I'd imagine Ao would need to see the benefits for something like this before allowing it.
He allowed the Mulhorandi Pantheon to spread their influence during the time of fallen Imaskar without 'clear' benefits to him or his cause [whatever that is]. So I don't think he would not allow the merging of some Torilian deities with the Mulhorandi Pantheon just because he sees no benefits in it.
I'd be careful with assigning any type of "directive" to the will of Ao. He's/She's/It's the unknown divine quantity for a reason.
Having said that, I will note that Powers & Pantheons makes it quite clear that when Ao heard the prayers of the Mulhorandi people, he acted to ensure their faith would follow through to Toril. Whether that benefited either himself or his cause, simply isn't for us to know.
Thus, I imagine Ao would probably allow the type of merger you're referring to, only if a similar scenario among the remaining faithful were to play out. Then, allowing the Mulhorandi deities to merge with existing Torilian powers, would at least ensure that the prayers of the faithful are received and, when necessary, acted upon. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
|
|
|
Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 08 Nov 2011 : 17:33:55
|
| I never realised that our earth has had visitors from the realms. |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
The Mulhorandi Pantheon: Where are they now?
