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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
551 Posts |
 Posted - 14 Apr 2022 : 16:23:44
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What's known about Askavar and the Wood of Sharp Teeth? The 2e boxed set indicates the elven nation abandoned the forest about 800 years ago, so in the 6th century DR, and that the local populace believes there is a ruined city there (which would be the capital of the former elven nation). Has that been detailed anywhere? I have a working theory about something but I want to get my facts straight.
Jeff
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My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
My streamed AD&D Spelljamer sessions: https://www.youtube.com/user/aulddragon/playlists?flow=grid&shelf_id=18&view=50
"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2022 : 16:39:37
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I have this in my notes. I cannot determine from whence it came, though. I can only say for sure that I did not come up with this and would have only included it in my notes if was from a canon source.
"This vast expanse of forest located south of Scornubel and Baldur’s Gate is an unconquered wilderness that derives its name from the abundance of creatures here that are unfriendly to humankind. The only encroachment of civilization has taken place on the forest’s southern edge, where an eccentric dwarf built what is now known as Durlag’s Tower. The dwarf has long since passed on, and the tower has passed through several masters over the decades, many of whom were unable to withstand the onslaught of residents from the Wood of Sharp Teeth.
The forest is a maze of tangled undergrowth and towering duskwood trees, many of which can be seen from the passing caravan route. None of citizenry of Baldur’s Gate dare fell these valuable treasures, because anyone who has tried has found death at the hands of the beings, both intelligent and non-intelligent, that dwell among them.
The Wood of Sharp Teeth is home to a number of intelligent humanoid species. Satyrs are found here in large numbers, as are their reported counterparts, the dryads. It is also believed that a number of wolfwere clans call the Wood of Sharp Teeth home. A small population of werewolves has also lived here for centuries, although in recent decades they have been retreating from the more numerous wolfweres. Legends hold that a ruined city stands forgotten somewhere in the forest’s depth, a city from which a most remarkable werewolf—one who had a talent both for sorcery and for organizing his otherwise chaotic and independent kind under a single banner—had intended to conquer the surrounding area and establish a kingdom where his kind would rule supreme. His dreams of empire crumbled when a mighty wizard—some say Elminster—laid waste to the city.
As with many legends, this one has a basis in truth. The scrolls Arahnar acquired from Angah Lalla (see Parts Two and Three) contain historical fragments copied from a temple devoted to the elven moon goddess Sehanine. They relate the tale of Vehlarr, a highly unusual natural lycanthrope who was an accomplished sorcerer and who was a favored servant of both Malar the Beast Lord and Sehanine the Lunar Lady. With the support and aid of these otherwise antagonistic entities, Vehlarr started to organize the werewolf packs of the Wood of Long Teeth into a coherent nation, even building a fortified city deep within the forest.
Vehlarr had grown increasingly disturbed by the number of lycanthropes that were falling victim to the magical lure that the would-be destroyer of the Shoon Empire, Syri Mhaal, had placed upon Myth Lharast. The deities, too, resented Syri Mhaal’s actions, particularly Sehanine who felt Syri Mhaal had corrupted a city that was built partly in her honor.
In the year 712, with hundreds of werewolf packs organized around him, safely within the city that came to bear his name, for Sehanine blessed the area so it was protected from the Myth Lharast’s magical draw, Vehlarr started drafting plans to strike at Syri Mhaal. Vehlarr knew that he could not attack Myth Lharast without falling victim to the city’s unholy charm effects. Instead, he endeavored to construct a gate that would allow him and his loyal soldiers to enter Myth Lharast directly from Vehlarr’s city. Through secrets revealed to him by Sehanine, he built his gate so it was keyed to the other city’s mythal. The gate, called the Circle of Vehlarr, was completed in 720, and Vehlarr launched his assault in a coordinated attack with the Cowled Conjurers who also sought to stop Syri Mhaal.
Something, however, went wrong. The combined might of the werewolves and the Cowled Conjurers proved not to be a match for Syri Mhaal’s forces. As they were on the brink of defeat, the patience of Selune, the other goddess to whom Myth Lharast had originally been dedicated, came to an end. She blasted the city from the face of the Realms, killing almost all the combatants in the process. Magical energies surged through the Circle of Vehlarr and shattered much of the surrounding city. Without their leader, the werewolves who dwelled there scattered to the four winds rather than attempt to rebuild it.
However, a persistent legend has arisen among the werewolf packs of the Wood of Sharp Teeth—Vehlarr lives still, existing on another plane where Myth Lharast still exists. Everyone there is un-aging except for the nights of the full moon when the city returns to Aber-Toril and can still be accessed through the Circle of Vehlarr. Unfortunately, no one who has attempted to locate the lost ruins of Vehlarr’s city has ever returned to verify whether there is truth to the story or not. This includes Arahnar’s pack." |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
551 Posts |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2022 : 19:08:30
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| Well, Myth Lharast is detailed on page 54 of book 2 of the 2e Lands of Intrigue expansion. Askavar is mentioned in Under Illefarn Anew on page 17 and Champions of Valor (3e) page 62. Maybe Eric or George has some some information about it? |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2022 : 21:35:29
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Well, Myth Lharast is detailed on page 54 of book 2 of the 2e Lands of Intrigue expansion. Askavar is mentioned in Under Illefarn Anew on page 17 and Champions of Valor (3e) page 62. Maybe Eric or George has some some information about it?
Oh, that entry in Lands of Intrigue clears up Myth Lharast; I now know for certain it was never an elven enclave in the Wood of Sharp Teeth. Very helpful!
Any idea when Torsil fell? Seems like it has to be before circa 570 DR, right?
Jeff |
My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
My streamed AD&D Spelljamer sessions: https://www.youtube.com/user/aulddragon/playlists?flow=grid&shelf_id=18&view=50
"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
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Gelcur
Senior Scribe
503 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2022 : 01:24:34
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| I had done some research on Askavar a while back, but my memory is foggy. Luckily at an earlier point and time I had replied to someone here. Maybe something there will help. |
The party come to a town befallen by hysteria
Rogue: So what's in the general store?
DM: What are you looking for?
Rogue: Whatevers in the store.
DM: Like what?
Rogue: Everything.
DM: There is a lot of stuff.
Rogue: Is there a cart outside?
DM: (rolls) Yes.
Rogue: We'll take it all, we may need it for the greater good. |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 15:30:52
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George and I developed this accounting, which touches on Askavar, the Realm of Glimmering Pools.
Fall of Dorlion Caradoon
The Emirate of Torsil lay along the Sword Coast, north of the northwestern foothills of the Cloud Peaks and south of Candlekeep, one of the last Calishar Emirates to be established. This region was occupied by Torsil, a Shoonite general, in the Year of the Tusk (112 DR), despite the opposition of the Fair Folk of Askavar (Modern: Wood of Sharp Teeth), during the reign of Riqysar Hazamir al Aktorral, for the glory of the coming qyar, Shoon III. The Emirate of Torsil was largely ungoverned, ruled only as far as the general's troops could reach with their swords, and the land saw constant skirmishing between Torsil’s army and the Fair Folk of Askavar in the years that followed.
In the Year of the Addled Arcanist (128 DR), the Raurinese archmage known as Hilather (Halaster Blackcloak) established himself in an abandoned tower near the site of present-day Beregost, on the emirate’s border with elf-ruled lands. In the catacombs beneath his newly appropriated tower, the Raurinese wizard either located or created a planar breach between the Material Plane and the Abyss. Drawing on the large body of genie lore that had been developed by Calishite sorcerers over the centuries and the process for creating a mirror of life trapping, he devised a process whereby he could summon all manner of nether beings and permanently bind them into physical objects.
After four years of experimentation, Hilather emerged from seclusion in the Year of Thirteen Prides Lost (132 DR) with thirteen Demonshields in hand, which he presented to the Imperial Court. Although the newly installed Qysar Amahl Shoon IV was reportedly pleased with the Raurinese wizard’s work, the process by which Hilather created the Demonshields was never reproduced, for reasons that remain obscure. Hilather apparently vanished later that same day with a mysterious payment in hand, and the only chronicle of his work, supposedly recorded in a non- descript libram entitled Hilather’s Workbook, seems to have been lost shortly thereafter.
In the wake of Hilather’s disappearance, his tower fell empty and abandoned. The Emirate of Torsil soon collapsed in the Year of the Executioner (140 DR), after the aging emir was called back to Shoonach, only to be rewarded for his years of service by being executed by the increasingly paranoid Qysar Amahl Shoon IV.
In the Year of the Mist Dragon (231 DR), Ilhundyl of Volothamp, who came to be known as the “Mad Mage,” conquered the halflings of Meiritin, located along the eastern shores of the great lake of the Ralamnish Ridings (now known as Lake Esmel) ,and declared himself ruler of the Calishar Emirates. Among Ilhundyl’s apprentices was one Uldoon, the “Mage of Fangs.”
In the Year of Many Mushrooms (238 DR), Ilhundyl meets his demise at the hands of Elminster Aumar and Myrjala Dark-Eyes, and rule of the Ralamnish Ridings returned to the Shoon Imperium. Uldoon fled north across the Cloud Peaks into the lands once known as the Emirate of Torsil, beyond the reach of the qysar’s court. There he established himself in Hilather’s abandoned tower, proclaiming himself ruler of Torsil (at the time an empty title with vaguely defined borders).
In the decades that followed, Uldoon slowly built Torsil into an actual realm, largely populated by expatriates of the Shoon Imperium who had fled beyond writ of the qysar. At its largest extent, Uldoon’s realm grew to encompass the region bounded by the modern-day landmarks of Beregost, Nashkel, and Durlag’s Tower, including the Fangs at the southern end of the pass through the Cloud Peaks.
In the Year of Pages Perilous (262 DR), Uldoon succeeded in reopening a portal to the Abyss, a legacy of Hilather’s prior residence. Over time, Uldoon grew fond of summoning fiends of all types to send against rival holds that bordered his realm, as well as the elves of Askavar, who had their homes in nearby Glimmerwood (the present-day Wood of Sharp Teeth). He developed a reputation as a ruthless—some say insane—spellhurler who consorted with many denizens of the Lower Planes, and Torsil soon collapsed in all but name.
The increasingly fiend-wracked lands of Torsil lasted until the Year of the Guarded Stance (380 DR), when an Ilmatari paladin brought Dornavver (see Champions of Ruin), the bastard sword better known as Demonbane, north to Torsil. The tale of how this unnamed paladin, wielding the mighty Dornavver, vanquished Torsil and the fiends therein is recounted in a ballad titled “Uldoon’s Doom,” a popular song still sung by bards of the Sword Coast today.
In the wake of Uldoom’s death, Torsil reverted to wilderness, albeit still plagued by the fiendish legacies of the Mage of Fangs. In response, the Church of Tyr established the Grim Bastion of Justice, a fortified abbey of the Maimed God west of Uldoom’s tower, on the site of modern day Beregost in the Year of Steel Roses (382 DR).
In the centuries that followed, the Grim Bastion stood guard against any resurgence of fiendish activity, allying themselves with the Fair Folk of Askavar. For nearly two centuries that alliance safeguarded the region, but the departure of Askavar’s elves for Evereska and Evermeet in the Year of Bright Fangs (570 DR) ended that alliance. As the presence of fiends in the region had largely subsided, the Tyrrans relocated southwards to Amn, where they were welcomed by King Corl I.
In the Year of the Swordforging (977 DR), Sir Dorlion Caradoon of the Knights of Samular led a small band of knights south from the Dessarin Vale towards the Alimir Mountains in eastern Calimshan, leaving his ring of Samular in trust with __ Caradoon. (Dorlion had a twin, named Wurthar, also a paladin of Tyr. The two brothers were known to swap identities from time to time, so it is possible it was actually Wurthar who led the expedition, but, if so, that truth was never revealed.) Dorlion’s company intended to make a pilgrimage to Allyn’s Anvil, built by Belaros, Mortal Hammer of Tyr, some 4,000 years prior, in hopes of reforging several recently recovered, powerful blades that had once been held by House Caradoon. Their planned route took them south to the Grimhammer’s Hall in Crimmor in Amn, then to the Fortress Faithful south of Zazesspur, then east to Barakmordin along Ithal Road, and from there south to the Alimir Mountains.
Along the way, the company took rest amidst the abandoned abbey next to Uldoom’s Tower. It is not clear if it was a genuine threat or some siren call of the Abyss that appealed to the child of Yamarral, but Dorlion abruptly departed in the middle of the night to explore the catacombs beneath the tower and never returned. While his companions bravely followed after him into the depths the following morn, when they discovered he was missing, the Knights of Samular found naught but empty halls. Eventually, the Tyrrans departed in despair, continuing on with their quest without their leader despite Dorlion’s absence and the loss of two legacies of House Caradoon which he had been carrying.
By the following spring, the Knights of Samular had arrived at Allyn’s Anvil. To their horror, as they approached, they witnessed a massive explosion that shattered a surrounding semicircle of boulders. As the smoke cleared, the Knights thought they caught a glimpse of Dorlion in the embrace of a bat-winged harlot ere the duo flew away, but none of the Tyrrans could be sure.
Nothing more was ever heard of Dorlion or the items that he carried, but his disappearance preceded the creation of the Collector’s Guild in Amn by only a handful of years. Ever since, the Knights of Samular have found themselves engaged in a shadowy race to reclaim the missing artifacts of House Caradoon, and their foes seems to know as much as the scions of Samular as to what to seek. As for Hilather’s Tower, in the Year of Crimson Magics (1026 DR), Ulcaster the Conjurer established a school of conjuration there that attracted would-be mages from up and down the Sword Coast, and eventually lead to the founding of Beregost.
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
Edited by - ericlboyd on 22 Apr 2022 18:40:08 |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 15:49:33
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quote:
Originally posted by AuldDragon
Looks like that text is from here:
https://web.archive.org/web/20080519041246/http://www.wizards.com:80/forgottenrealms/DnD_COV_006.asp
I wasn't able to find any further information on Myth Lharast (or Lharest?), but there's no mention of the Askavar at all. All in all, it seems somewhat disconnected to that lore, and the whole dynamic between Sehanine, Malar, and Selune seems kinda bonkers to me. Has any of this been detailed anywhere other than this one series of web articles?
Jeff
Myth Lharast is not in the Wood of Sharp Teeth. Myth Lharast lies roughly 5 miles west of the Gem Road, at the Splendarrllur's westernmost bend.
The original reference to Myth Lharast is from Ruins of Myth Drannor: Campaign Guide, page 22. I also touched on it in Faith & Avatars, pages 136-137. Steven expanded on it in Lands of Intrigue: Amn, pages 20, 21, 54-55, |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6353 Posts |
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Mankyle
Acolyte
Spain
42 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 19:20:59
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In Dragon 222 there is an article called "Green Elves of Faerûn"
There is an entry about the wood of Sharp Teeth
quote:
The Wood of the Sharp Teeth
Recently, a small group of green elves
(about 50) has broken off from the tribe in
the Misty Forest and headed into the
Wood of Sharp Teeth near Baldur#146;s Gate.
It seems there was an argument between
Speaker Eamond and Derdryl, an older
and much sterner elf, about courting the
favors of humans. The last report from
the Derdryl#146;s group said that they had
made a temporary pact with a tribe of
satyrs and were continuing to forage deep
into the woods. Derdryl, it seems, is
obsessed in finding the ancient elven
empire of Anauria. He has used the argument between himself and Eamond to
gather a group to explore the unknown
reaches of the Sharp Teeth. What he
expects to find is up to speculation. The
ruins of that fabled empire are old even
by elven standards, and it would appear
that Derdryl is leading his group on a
wild, and very dangerous, goose chase
Is says Anauria, but I think this refers to Askavar |
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
551 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 19:44:13
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Myth Lharast is not in the Wood of Sharp Teeth. Myth Lharast lies roughly 5 miles west of the Gem Road, at the Splendarrllur's westernmost bend.
The original reference to Myth Lharast is from Ruins of Myth Drannor: Campaign Guide, page 22. I also touched on it in Faith & Avatars, pages 136-137. Steven expanded on it in Lands of Intrigue: Amn, pages 20, 21, 54-55,
Thanks for the lore and the page references! I did find the section in Lands of Intrigue (the material on the werewolves of the Wood of Sharp Teeth made no reference of the location, so I had assumed it was closer to/inside the forest). It allowed me to discount it as what I was looking for. I really appreciate it! :)
Jeff |
My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
My streamed AD&D Spelljamer sessions: https://www.youtube.com/user/aulddragon/playlists?flow=grid&shelf_id=18&view=50
"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
873 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 21:26:21
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
George and I developed this accounting, which touches on Askavar, the Realm of Glimmering Pools.
[...] the Collector’s Guild in Amn [...]
The what? Did I miss a power player in Amn or is this a new entry added by you? |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 21:59:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Demzer
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
George and I developed this accounting, which touches on Askavar, the Realm of Glimmering Pools.
[...] the Collector’s Guild in Amn [...]
The what? Did I miss a power player in Amn or is this a new entry added by you?
Best of the Realms, Volume III, "The Knights of Samular" (The anthology of stories by Elaine Cunningham.)
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 22:06:00
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| Eric/George, are you looking at Lord Ashar ignoring Torsil on his march north to the High Moor in 375 DR? And that Azoun I's forces ignoring it when they were chasing Ashar south? Finally, that paladin that actually cleaned up Torsil in 380, could he/she have been associated in some way with Azoun I's forces in the previous years? |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2022 : 23:02:02
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Eric/George, are you looking at Lord Ashar ignoring Torsil on his march north to the High Moor in 375 DR? And that Azoun I's forces ignoring it when they were chasing Ashar south? Finally, that paladin that actually cleaned up Torsil in 380, could he/she have been associated in some way with Azoun I's forces in the previous years?
If you look at the map in Lands of Intrigue, Torsil was north of the western Cloud Peaks, southwest of the Wood of Sharp Teeth, south of Candlekeep, centered around Beregost.
Valashar, according to LoI, was in eastern Amn. It stretched from the headwaters of the Sulduskoon to those of the Amstel River, its western border flush with the halfling realm of Meiritin. Meiritin, a halfling realm, was established in the Tejam Hills and areas east of the great lake.
So, Torsil is not really anywhere along the way between Valashar and the High Moor. Ashar would have probably marched north through the Giant's Plain to get to the High Moor. Possibly he would have skirted around the eastern or western end of the Snakewood, but there's no way he would have gone past Torsil. Either way, he'd go east of the Wood of Sharp Teeth.
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
Edited by - ericlboyd on 22 Apr 2022 23:19:57 |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2022 : 04:05:58
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Eric/George, are you looking at Lord Ashar ignoring Torsil on his march north to the High Moor in 375 DR? And that Azoun I's forces ignoring it when they were chasing Ashar south? Finally, that paladin that actually cleaned up Torsil in 380, could he/she have been associated in some way with Azoun I's forces in the previous years?
If you look at the map in Lands of Intrigue, Torsil was north of the western Cloud Peaks, southwest of the Wood of Sharp Teeth, south of Candlekeep, centered around Beregost.
Valashar, according to LoI, was in eastern Amn. It stretched from the headwaters of the Sulduskoon to those of the Amstel River, its western border flush with the halfling realm of Meiritin. Meiritin, a halfling realm, was established in the Tejam Hills and areas east of the great lake.
So, Torsil is not really anywhere along the way between Valashar and the High Moor. Ashar would have probably marched north through the Giant's Plain to get to the High Moor. Possibly he would have skirted around the eastern or western end of the Snakewood, but there's no way he would have gone past Torsil. Either way, he'd go east of the Wood of Sharp Teeth.
--Eric
Thank you for that clarification. Based on the routing you have, he would have gone south of Iriaebor and Sulduskoon (Berdusk), west of the Reaching Woods, and likely crossed the Chionthar at Elturel (or whatever was there at the time). Does that sound about right? I am trying to make sure I have a good picture of what was going on in the area at the time. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
873 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2022 : 04:35:36
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
quote:
Originally posted by Demzer
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
George and I developed this accounting, which touches on Askavar, the Realm of Glimmering Pools.
[...] the Collector’s Guild in Amn [...]
The what? Did I miss a power player in Amn or is this a new entry added by you?
Best of the Realms, Volume III, "The Knights of Samular" (The anthology of stories by Elaine Cunningham.)
--Eric
Damn, I knew I should've gotten the anthologies! So much to read, so little time ...
Thanks for the pointer! |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 23 Apr 2022 : 05:51:11
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
Thank you for that clarification. Based on the routing you have, he would have gone south of Iriaebor and Sulduskoon (Berdusk), west of the Reaching Woods, and likely crossed the Chionthar at Elturel (or whatever was there at the time). Does that sound about right? I am trying to make sure I have a good picture of what was going on in the area at the time.
Yes, that sounds about right. He could have also crossed at Scornubel (or whatever was there at the time).
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Askavar and the Wood of Sharp Teeth
