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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 09:17:01
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I always wonder why Vampiric Drow haven't taken over. They have everything going for them. All the advantages being a Drow and Vampirism but not having to deal with coming out in the bright of day - since there is none in the underdark. On top of that, if you combine the longevity of the Drow with that of a Vampire, I would assume they could easily live for several thousands of years....
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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
231 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 11:14:15
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| Do do they have the numbers to take over? |
"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Thelonius
Senior Scribe
Spain
730 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 11:26:23
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| Besides their longevity and numbers they should have to face Beholders, Mind-Flayers, Drow wizards, Drow priestess, drow master of arms with their enchanted weapons.... I mean there are a lot of dangers for a vampire besides the light. The fact you can not die from those weapons, though clerical magic can easily destroy an undead creature, doesn't mean you can overtake a place, specially if you spend most of your life as a smoke cloud.... |
"If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." - Kreia
"I THINK I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR-RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE"- Discworld's Death frustrated after Rincewind scapes his grasp... again.
"I am death, come for thee" - Nimbul, from Baldur's Gate I just before being badly spanked
Sapientia sola libertas est |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 13:10:04
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Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 13:50:46
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| They did take over ixitxachitl |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 14:16:49
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Where is that detailed? And why did Demogorgon allow that to happen? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 15:11:24
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| Vampires, drow or otherwise, tend to be solitary territorial creatures. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 15:55:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain.
Yep, the only time i have read about vampires working together is when some Lich or Archmage is commanding them. Many of Szass Tam's generals were vampires correct? |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 19:26:31
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TURN/REBUKE UNDEAD!
Also there are vampire drow, but they are opposed by those just as powerful. Such as the Dean of Necromancy in Sshamath and I think one of the leaders of Undrek'thoz. But they have all those other powers arrayed against them. They don't want an army of other vampires that might unseat their power, or create a food shortage (have you seen the movie "day breakers"?) Not all vampires know how to create new vampires, either. As is shown in the description of Ched Nasad. Why does vampire trump all? |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 21:22:41
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quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
TURN/REBUKE UNDEAD!
Also there are vampire drow, but they are opposed by those just as powerful. Such as the Dean of Necromancy in Sshamath and I think one of the leaders of Undrek'thoz. But they have all those other powers arrayed against them. They don't want an army of other vampires that might unseat their power, or create a food shortage (have you seen the movie "day breakers"?) Not all vampires know how to create new vampires, either. As is shown in the description of Ched Nasad. Why does vampire trump all?
Good point. I think Daybreakers clearly shows what would happen to a society that's predominantly composed of vampires.
There maybe less "big fishes" in the Underdark compared to the surface world or other planes, but they are still big enough to devour drow vampires. Sorcerous illithiliches, for example, easily make the drow vampires appear like ants. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 21:28:47
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain.
Yep, the only time i have read about vampires working together is when some Lich or Archmage is commanding them. Many of Szass Tam's generals were vampires correct?
I'm not sure if there are many. But I recall some from Red Magic and The Captive Flame. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 23:30:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain.
They are pretty darned close and when you add in the drow heritage and any additional character class (Assasin, priest, Mage) that's a lethal combo in my book.
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2012 : 23:39:42
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain.
Yep, the only time i have read about vampires working together is when some Lich or Archmage is commanding them. Many of Szass Tam's generals were vampires correct?
Isn't there a rumor of a vampiric house in one of the major Drow cities? |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 02:10:47
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanz
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Some archmages have vampire servants. Vampires, drow or not, are simply not on top of the food chain.
They are pretty darned close and when you add in the drow heritage and any additional character class (Assasin, priest, Mage) that's a lethal combo in my book.
They all have to be archmages or at the very least have a greater deity as their patron to be that close. The drow are near the top of the food chain in the Underdark primarily because of Lloth. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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phranctoast
Learned Scribe
USA
151 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 17:07:17
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| What archmages have vampire servants...other than lichs of course? |
Currently reading: Spider and Stone by Jaleigh Johnson: Sequel to Mistshore |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 17:47:44
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quote:
Originally posted by phranctoast
What archmages have vampire servants...other than lichs of course?
Probably evil ones.  |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 17:57:50
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quote:
Originally posted by phranctoast
What archmages have vampire servants...other than lichs of course?
Dracoliches have all sorts of undead servants, including vampires. Malygris, who is a dracolich, is a mere lackey of Telamont. So by proxy, Telamont has vampire servants. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 22:39:02
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| There WAS a vampiric smoke drake (Brimstone) in the Year of Rogue Dragons trilogy. I'm pretty sure that would trump a vampiric drow..... Also, there is the house of Kiaransalle-worshipers in one of the drow cities (in the 3.5 City of the Spider Queen sourcebook, I think, or it might have been Underdark) that was led by drow vampire(s). So far they are the only major players among drow that I know of who are vamps. Beyond that, there are simply too few of them to make much of a difference. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36782 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 22:41:12
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by phranctoast
What archmages have vampire servants...other than lichs of course?
Probably evil ones.
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 23:30:51
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I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36782 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 23:37:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers
I dunno, I'm digging the idea of a vampire matron mother. Maybe one who is entirely behind the scenes, and who is only known to the 'public' matron mother and a few other high-ranking nobles within the house. 
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Fellfire
Master of Realmslore
1965 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 23:49:49
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| In City of the Spider Queen one of Irae Tssaran's (the BBEG and Matron Mother of House Tssaran) daughters and lieutenants was vampiric. It is said after she is slain then resurrected that she prefers a vampiric existence and immediately seeks to return to it. |
Misanthorpe
Love is a lie. Only hate endures. Light is blinding. Only in darkness do we see clearly.
"Oh, you think darkness is your ally? You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but.. blinding. The shadows betray you because they belong to me." - Bane The Dark Knight Rises
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Edited by - Fellfire on 20 Jan 2012 00:10:58 |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 23:50:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers
Unlike most races, the drow consider it an honor to be granted the Kiss of Lolth, as they refer to vampirism. The dark elves view vampires with both awe and trepidation, believing undeath to be a state of being that brings an elf closer to a true understanding of the powers that surge through the universe. Such knowledge brings immense power, which the dark elves both crave and respect.
http://www.lomion.de/cmm/vampdrow.php |
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jordanz
Senior Scribe
553 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2012 : 23:52:26
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanz
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers
If the Drow of the Realms are anything like the Drow of Ravenloft...
Unlike most races, the drow consider it an honor to be granted the Kiss of Lolth, as they refer to vampirism. The dark elves view vampires with both awe and trepidation, believing undeath to be a state of being that brings an elf closer to a true understanding of the powers that surge through the universe. Such knowledge brings immense power, which the dark elves both crave and respect.
http://www.lomion.de/cmm/vampdrow.php
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Fellfire
Master of Realmslore
1965 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 00:09:03
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| Also, though not FR, the Vault of the Drow (Dragon 298) describes the city as having an "impressive vampiric community." Also in that article is this statement imparting drow feelings towards vampirism. "Even in Erelhei-Cinlu, a city devoted to addiction and depravity, the vampire and vampire spawn's addiction to blood is considered declasse, little better than the ghouls' craving for flesh." |
Misanthorpe
Love is a lie. Only hate endures. Light is blinding. Only in darkness do we see clearly.
"Oh, you think darkness is your ally? You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but.. blinding. The shadows betray you because they belong to me." - Bane The Dark Knight Rises
Green Dragonscale Dice Bag by Crystalsidyll - check it out
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 00:53:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers
I could see a possibility for a lost or forgotten drow colony/city having fallen prey to a vampire invasion -- the result being responsible for a select number of Kanchelsis-worshipping vampiric drow. They would venerate him as the Rake, emphasising the calculatingly cold culture of both the drow and the vampiric deity. |
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Edited by - The Sage on 20 Jan 2012 00:55:05 |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 01:09:30
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The Kiaransalee-worshipping family of Irae Tssaran was exactly the family I was thinking of when I speculated that Lolth might not be all that keen on vampire drow. I was thinking of how drow vampires might work in Menzoberranzan, which I didn't imagine would be all that strong an element.
But Jordanz's find is intriguing. I stand corrected that it is indeed quite plausible!
Also, to address the OP, that's a little like asking why vampires haven't taken over EVERYWHERE. (I mean, outside of publishing.)
I think it's a combination of rarity and need for a population of mortals to support them. You can't have a whole city of vampires, for instance, because they'd have no mortal blood to drink. Not to mention that vampires aren't always the best organized forces. Picture a freshly made drow vampire: I think when you suddenly apply vampire mentality to the already treacherous and violent drow, they're MUCH more likely to kill each other than to form strong bonds and alliances.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 01:45:59
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Curiously, now that I think back on this, I actually recall a brief reference in the 2e Menzoberranzan boxed set that suggested the Masters of Sorcere were worried about vampire infiltration and influence among some of the drow at the Academy, after finding the dried husk-bodies of several wizards.
This might be a way in for those looking to establish vampiric drow in the City of the Spider-Queen. |
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Edited by - The Sage on 20 Jan 2012 01:46:19 |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 02:20:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I would think drow culture isn't very amiable to lots of undeath. That's a Kiaransalee thing--not a Lolth thing. So with the drow under the tight yoke of Lolth's church, I would expect a vampire takeover to take a lot of time.
Which doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen--it would make a really cool story.
Cheers
I dunno, I'm digging the idea of a vampire matron mother. Maybe one who is entirely behind the scenes, and who is only known to the 'public' matron mother and a few other high-ranking nobles within the house.
I kinda like the sound of that. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7974 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 02:23:39
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| I think the OP's question suggested an answer to itself. Anything and anyone in the Underdark which becomes too powerful and threatening had better be able to consistently leverage that power decisively. If a drow vampire exists somewhere on the fringe of drow society (where it can find drow to eat) then you can bet the drow will eventually mount an offensive to remove the predator. Vampires have too many (well known) vulnerabilities to hide or defend themselves against determined adversaries forever, and they'd only get one chance to fail when playing deadly games against superior numbers. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2012 : 02:26:23
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Curiously, now that I think back on this, I actually recall a brief reference in the 2e Menzoberranzan boxed set that suggested the Masters of Sorcere were worried about vampire infiltration and influence among some of the drow at the Academy, after finding the dried husk-bodies of several wizards.
This might be a way in for those looking to establish vampiric drow in the City of the Spider-Queen.
Agreed. Though, as pointed out earlier, the vampires' number is too small to be a great threat. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Vampiric Drow
