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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
 Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 23:34:19
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I know this isn't a Core product but it's GOOD. I wish they'd make Realms supplements like this.
I was a little wry about the price tag but after looking at the DMs for the last two days, all I know is I want it! :)
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
Edited by - SirUrza on 31 Aug 2006 23:35:56
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 23:52:45
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| Mines on order and I know Sage has a copy. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 08:52:17
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| Hope you didn't order it from Amazon.Com. I've heard they will NOT be fullfilling a single order because it's being billed as a Hobbyshop only product by White Wolf. |
"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 09:24:41
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quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
I know this isn't a Core product but it's GOOD. I wish they'd make Realms supplements like this.
It is very good. The level of detail allows one to be really immersed in the setting and the quality of the book is delightful. Unfortunately, it is expensive and for that reason I can't recommend it without reservation. However, I am very pleased that I own it. It's good for my imagination and creativity.
When I was associated with an online version of Menzoberranzan I tried to do something similar. That is, lots of NPC's, giving each district a definite feel, creating levels of intrigue and really trying to make the city work. I worked out the income for all of the major houses, and put a lot of thought into how Menzoberranzan's economy worked. My reasoning for this was that would be a big driver in creating adventure hooks.
Reading Ptolus makes me wish I could do the same thing with Menzoberranzan, which is a tribute to Ptolus. When a book inspires you and makes you want to do something then it's a good book. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 15:06:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Mines on order and I know Sage has a copy. :)
Indeed.
I haven't even finished reading through the first section yet.
From my studies over the last week though, of over 600+ pages, supplemental material on CD and from ptolus.com... I am still simply amazed by the amount of detail (both epic and mundane [the mundane details are, as always important for some of us]) that Monte's put together for this. I read all his Design Diaries when he was working on Ptolus, but they can in no way compare to the sheer scope and overall detail and lore on the city itself, and the surrounding country and the world. The CD includes electronic copies of the adventure that comes with Ptolus, copies of Chaositech and The Banewarrens, and a number of other features that provide extra detail for the campaign.
One of the things I immediately noticed is that, while stats and rules *are* necessary for a complex campaign setting like Ptolus... I liked the fact that there aren't pages and pages of rules and stats presented that seem to choke the lore like we've seen in some WotC d20 products (FR in particular). |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 01 Sep 2006 15:06:39 |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 15:52:17
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quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
Hope you didn't order it from Amazon.Com. I've heard they will NOT be fullfilling a single order because it's being billed as a Hobbyshop only product by White Wolf.
Nah,
I ordered it locally from my comic guy cause he gives 30 to 35% off if you pay cash if it's a RPG book. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 16:45:37
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
One of the things I immediately noticed is that, while stats and rules *are* necessary for a complex campaign setting like Ptolus... I liked the fact that there aren't pages and pages of rules and stats presented that seem to choke the lore like we've seen in some WotC d20 products (FR in particular).
That's an excellent point.  |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Beirnadri Magranth
Senior Scribe
USA
720 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 17:23:14
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I reall want it but I have a lot of other payments to make including car tires and my new chocolate phone!
anyway, I'm really excited to see this kinda of extreme detail high page count tome be published. They even said that if this book is a success that they will try and do more like it. Again, I love the format!!! I just think they should do it with more of a campaign setting in mind so they don't shy away from completing plots (as opposed to leaving them still a little vague to allow them to be put into different campaigns) Since its purpose it to be specific it would help if it wasn't holding back adn went all out.... which is why something like this for Faerun would blow the other books out of the water. Like maybe one about waterdeep..... because you go over ancient elven and dwarven history, multiple stages of human history, and the entire undermountain excitement.
That city is the first to strike me as a palce with basically everything.... oh wait omg!!! hold up!
if the new Myth Teshurr (as i like to call the new myth drannor post-baker) is as culturally accepting as the old one this could defiantely be featured like WOAH!!!
that's it.... the only way Forgotten Realms can make me happy is by doing a Ptolus style book about Myth Teshurr. |
"You came here to be a martyr in a great big bang of glory... instead you will die with a whimper."
::moussaoui tries to interrupt::
"You will never get a chance to speak again and that's an appropriate ending."
-Judge Brinkema |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2006 : 17:26:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
One of the things I immediately noticed is that, while stats and rules *are* necessary for a complex campaign setting like Ptolus... I liked the fact that there aren't pages and pages of rules and stats presented that seem to choke the lore like we've seen in some WotC d20 products (FR in particular).
That's an excellent point.
I liked that too, but I still think stats for NPCs is important. I like the break of characters though. Characters that don't need stats just list class, characters that need stats list their important stats. Feats that give modifiers start added into the bonuses without mention.
THAT's what we need for the Realms. Wizards has a great website that they could use or through Web Enhancements, they could give us the entire character sheet if they wanted. |
"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2006 : 06:36:34
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| Ugh.. I knew I shouldn't have looked at ebay. Reputable sellers are selling it $75-90 WITH The Night of Dissolution printed book. Unreal! |
"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Sanishiver
Senior Scribe
USA
476 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2006 : 07:49:19
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Bought it. Was the last one in my FLGS so they had to take down the map from the display!
So far it looks good in terms of material to mine from for my own Realms Campaign, which is very much in keeping with previous works by Cook and Co. that I've used to great benefit in my game.
I'm very pleased with the depth of material included on the CD. I chose not to by Chaositech when it was first published, but am happy it came with the CD. Note the free gaming materials alone (Chaositech, Night of Dissolution, The Banewarens and Player's Guide to Ptolus) together account for an additional ~370 pages of material!
J. Grenemyer |
09/20/2008: Tiger Army at the Catalyst in Santa Cruz. You wouldn’t believe how many females rode it out in the pit. Santa Cruz women are all of them beautiful. Now I know to add tough to that description.
6/27/2008: WALL-E is about the best damn movie Pixar has ever made. It had my heart racing and had me rooting for the good guy.
9/9/2006: Dave Mathews Band was off the hook at the Shoreline Amphitheater.
Never, ever read the game books too literally, or make such assumptions that what is omitted cannot be. Bad DM form, that.
And no matter how compelling a picture string theory paints, if it does not accurately describe our universe, it will be no more relevant than an elaborate game of Dungeons and Dragons. --paragraph 1, chapter 9, The Elegant Universe by Brian Greene |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2006 : 19:35:07
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| Yes the CD is awesome. I just hope that other publishers/developers don't try their hand at $100+ books that don't nearly match up in quality. |
"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Patrakis
Learned Scribe
Canada
256 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2006 : 05:38:09
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I liked that book immensely. In fact, i'll make Ptolus a central city one of the unknown continent in my FR campaign.
Pat |
Dancing is like standing still, but faster.
My site: http://www.patoumonde.com |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jan 2007 : 07:44:42
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I'm brining this one back just because every time I go to the FLGS this calls to me from the shelves. I pick it up and drool on it a bit, then look at the price tag again, and put it back on the shelf. Not unlike Wayne and his guitar in Wayne's World. But I digress.
What I want to ask is, if I dont' use Ptolus itself, and I don't run a campaign set there, will I still find enough stuff in this book to make it useful to pick it up and mine it for ideas/resources for the Forgotten Realms games? |
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Halidan
Senior Scribe
USA
470 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jan 2007 : 16:20:42
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
What I want to ask is, if I dont' use Ptolus itself, and I don't run a campaign set there, will I still find enough stuff in this book to make it useful to pick it up and mine it for ideas/resources for the Forgotten Realms games?
That's a tough question. I've had my copy of Ptolus for 3 months now, and I'm not even close to finishing with my initial read-through. It's got a ton of information.
Some of that information can certainly be transported over to any big city in the Realms. But be warned, a lot of the description are intertwined with others in the book. Monte has done a great job of creating an interlinked and complex city with Ptolus.
It can be hard to lift a single business to FR because many of the entries show how this place works with, buys from, sells to, and effects other locations in the city. My initial thought is that you'll want to life whole sections of the city just to preserve much of the linkage and useful information.
The other problem you might have is that Ptolus is definatly not a human-centric city -- especially in some of the more interesting sections of town. This means you may have to make some judicious race changes depending on where you want to place the Ptolus material in FR.
Still, I'd say that the book is a "should have" for most serious DM's, regaurdless of what setting they use. It isn't essential for your gameplay, but I think it should make your games more interesting with just a minor amount of work. |
"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"
Edgar Allen Poe - 1849 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31701 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jan 2007 : 23:19:47
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
What I want to ask is, if I dont' use Ptolus itself, and I don't run a campaign set there, will I still find enough stuff in this book to make it useful to pick it up and mine it for ideas/resources for the Forgotten Realms games?
Unfortunately, I can't really add anything to this discussion for the Realms, as most of my Ptolus material is being used for my PS campaigns.
Sorry Knight. 
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 11 Jan 2007 23:20:50 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6643 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2007 : 01:57:42
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Given how successful Ptolus has been, it makes you wonder how successful a FR product of similar vein would be ... would the FR-specific nature of it be a detractor? I don't have or intend to get Ptolus but it must be filled with info on people, places etc. Wouldn't that be just as hard to translate into another setting such as Eberron or someone's own homebrew campaign?
If they did a Ptolus treatment of Baldur's Gate or Neverwinter (to get some computer game spin-off advantages) I'd say it would sell, and sell well. I would have suggested Waterdeep but that would have meant the ultimate re-hash.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Dhomal
Senior Scribe
USA
565 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2007 : 02:57:57
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Given how successful Ptolus has been, it makes you wonder how successful a FR product of similar vein would be ... would the FR-specific nature of it be a detractor? I don't have or intend to get Ptolus but it must be filled with info on people, places etc. Wouldn't that be just as hard to translate into another setting such as Eberron or someone's own homebrew campaign?
If they did a Ptolus treatment of Baldur's Gate or Neverwinter (to get some computer game spin-off advantages) I'd say it would sell, and sell well. I would have suggested Waterdeep but that would have meant the ultimate re-hash.
-- George Krashos
Hello-
Funny you should mention that! :)
During one of the Realms seminars it was suggested that just something like this be done - judging from the popularity of the couyle of BIG items that previously have been done.
Certainly - Waterdeep came up. ON the surface - it makes the best choice - but even in the short time at the seminar - it was revealed that it would be just as George mentioned - a rehash. Many people would alreday have large tracts of the book. Would this hurt sales? Dunno. Ironically - the panel asked by way of hands - how many people would Buy such a product. 'lots of hands' Then - I asked - from the back - Is this the best idea? How many would buy a large book on say - Silverymoon (chosen by me - IIRC because Ed had just answered a question about Silverymnoon - and I had an inkling that he would like the idea!) - again - by show of hands - 'a lot of hands' - possibly even more.
Ultimately - any delve like this for something FR-specific will have to be judged by sales figures. Projections and the like. I would not be at all surprised if they will be looking at the 3-part mega-adventure this year as a loose guide as to how well something like this would sell.
Me? I dont know - but likely I would buy whatever. I learned that trying to segregate out certaink things can sometimes come back to haunt you. (like my conscious decision NOT to buy the Planescape stuff. Heck - I alreday HAD Spelljammer - what did I need that for...Ugh - bad choice!)
Dhomal |
I am collecting the D&D Minis. I would be more than willing to trade with people. You can send me a PM here with your email listed - and I can send you my minis list. Thanks!
Successfully traded with Xysma! |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2007 : 03:43:42
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quote:
Originally posted by DhomalHello-
Funny you should mention that! :)
During one of the Realms seminars it was suggested that just something like this be done - judging from the popularity of the couyle of BIG items that previously have been done.
Certainly - Waterdeep came up. ON the surface - it makes the best choice - but even in the short time at the seminar - it was revealed that it would be just as George mentioned - a rehash. Many people would alreday have large tracts of the book. Would this hurt sales? Dunno. Ironically - the panel asked by way of hands - how many people would Buy such a product. 'lots of hands' Then - I asked - from the back - Is this the best idea? How many would buy a large book on say - Silverymoon (chosen by me - IIRC because Ed had just answered a question about Silverymnoon - and I had an inkling that he would like the idea!) - again - by show of hands - 'a lot of hands' - possibly even more.
Ultimately - any delve like this for something FR-specific will have to be judged by sales figures. Projections and the like. I would not be at all surprised if they will be looking at the 3-part mega-adventure this year as a loose guide as to how well something like this would sell.
Me? I dont know - but likely I would buy whatever. I learned that trying to segregate out certaink things can sometimes come back to haunt you. (like my conscious decision NOT to buy the Planescape stuff. Heck - I alreday HAD Spelljammer - what did I need that for...Ugh - bad choice!)
Dhomal
Chris looked at us like we were insane when we did the show of hands. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2007 : 00:51:24
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I started to read this book finally since I've had it for a few months but it's hard to hold when you like reading in bed, so it's killing my hands and arms cause it's so heavy.
However, I'm into the player's section but I doubt that I'll set this place anywhere in FR and I'll probably use it in a homebrew world or somewhere else. Or, as was said above, on a continent in FR that's never been detailed.
However, I think I can use parts of it for FR cities and I know I've already used the street scene handouts that came in the packet as addition encounters to the lists that came in the City System box set for Waterdeep. It seems to me though that a lot of this could be changed and used as Waterdeep information or changed so that it fits in with what we know of Waterdeep. Course, I haven't read that much of the book yet, so that could be wrong but there are other parts that would have to be ignored if you used the info for Waterdeep.
When I read some more, after I rest my arms, I'll see what I want to do with the city. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 21 Jan 2007 01:25:05 |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2007 : 01:25:52
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
What I want to ask is, if I dont' use Ptolus itself, and I don't run a campaign set there, will I still find enough stuff in this book to make it useful to pick it up and mine it for ideas/resources for the Forgotten Realms games?
Unfortunately, I can't really add anything to this discussion for the Realms, as most of my Ptolus material is being used for my PS campaigns.
Sorry Knight.
That's not entirely true . . . you've used some of the NPCs recently, in Waterdeep. You could at least talk about those.
And the Sigil-based bits you've used from Ptolus might still be applicable for the Realms, in terms of urban adventuring.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 20 Feb 2007 : 02:28:40
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I still haven't finished reading it, it's not that I don't want, it's that there's so much goodness in it. :)
Anyway, there's plenty of good material as a DM you can use for any city or situation (god bless photocopiers!) whoever, it's far from a soure book and most of the information in there is for making Ptolus a more vibrant city. Of course you can use as much as you want or as little of it as you want to make cities in your campaign better.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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lokilokust
Seeker
USA
61 Posts |
Posted - 20 Feb 2007 : 05:39:27
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i've been considering picking this up...
any idea how it would work as a city off the prime material plane?
(i was thinking of the possibility of locating it on a demiplane, mostly.) |
yrs. in exile,
-s.j. bagley |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 20 Feb 2007 : 12:23:20
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Given how successful Ptolus has been, it makes you wonder how successful a FR product of similar vein would be ... would the FR-specific nature of it be a detractor?
I've been tinkering around with the idea of writing a Menzoberranzan version of Ptolus. I've got about 50 NPC's and lots of gangs, Houses and organisations and the city is ideal for the level of intrigue needed for a city-based campaign.
quote:
Originally posted by lokilokust
any idea how it would work as a city off the prime material plane?
It should work quite well since mostly all that is needed is to spot and remove the non-Realms references. Probably the best way it can work is an 'ideals' book - something that will help to inspire your imagination. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 20 Feb 2007 : 21:15:03
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quote:
Originally posted by lokilokust
i've been considering picking this up...
any idea how it would work as a city off the prime material plane?
(i was thinking of the possibility of locating it on a demiplane, mostly.)
It shouldn't be an issue.. or even matter how the PCs got there. Ptolus is campaign in itself, what goes on outside the city.. well isn't important. The whole product is designed so that there's so much to do, so many things going on IN THE CITY that your players don't need to know about the outside world, the city is basically the world. :) |
"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
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Ptolus: City by the Spire
