Candlekeep Forum
Candlekeep Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Members | Private Messages | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Forgotten Realms Journals
 General Forgotten Realms Chat
 Founding a Magical University
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Previous Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 03 Sep 2020 :  15:01:20  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Rinaldo

Woooly Rupert. Because a seperate researcher would be able to focus all their attention on the project at hand, instead of dividing their focus.



Unless you hire a person to research one spell and one spell only, they're going to be dividing their focus.

You're better off going with the person who knows his spells backwards and forwards and can teach it to others, rather than hiring some yahoo who may not know it as well.



While I do have some trouble seeing this place surviving (but I have no idea of the power level of the campaign or what the DM has given them), I can understand his concept of a separate group for research. Unfortunately, I view magic design through the lens that I've seen with my own work in real life. In many ways its similar to IT. Sometimes you need someone with an outsiders perspective to come in and say something that makes even the expert go "wait, I never thought of it like that". Sometimes you need an outsider to have an overview look of a lot of things to go "hmmm, I think we need X created in order to do things better".



But we already have the outsiders -- the students. Students are going to ask all sorts of questions like that and challenge the instructor.

And another skilled wizard wouldn't really be an outsider -- because they're using the same basic spells to do the same basic thing.

So it comes down to Wizard X and Wizard Y. Both know the same spells. X knows how to cast them, but that's it. Y knows how to cast them, and he knows the ins and outs of them well enough to teach those ins and outs to others... So Y has the deeper understanding of everything involved and would be the better person to develop something new.

Putting the experience aside for a moment, though, there's something else I just thought of: if it's known that this place is producing new spells, that makes it a target. It's already well-established in the Realms that there are wizards who hunt down other wizards just to gain their spells. This new spells department is going to be putting up a big sign that says "Attack here for spells no one else knows!"

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 03 Sep 2020 15:36:42
Go to Top of Page

sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
11686 Posts

Posted - 03 Sep 2020 :  19:17:19  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
It's one thing to have a novice listen to your ideas. Its another thing to have someone of a similar skill level but different focus listen to your ideas. Granted, there doesn't necessarily be a designated "design" department. It might be something to just have a periodic group meeting to discuss what projects people are working on, and certain people at the university might be designated to be part of a committee to make that happen between departments.
On the school being targeted for having new spells, that's going to be any magic school though with any success. This is why a few of us have been pointing out that before you do anything, working out security protocols is essential to a place like this surviving.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
Go to Top of Page

Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36779 Posts

Posted - 03 Sep 2020 :  22:59:57  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

It's one thing to have a novice listen to your ideas. Its another thing to have someone of a similar skill level but different focus listen to your ideas. Granted, there doesn't necessarily be a designated "design" department. It might be something to just have a periodic group meeting to discuss what projects people are working on, and certain people at the university might be designated to be part of a committee to make that happen between departments.




I'm not talking about having a novice listen to ideas. I'm saying that an instructor is going to have to know their stuff backwards and forwards to be able to teach it -- and students aren't going to have the same perspective, so they're likely to come up with the questions that make the instructor think "Hmm, I wonder if that's possible..."

So you've got that instructor, with a deeper understanding of magic and multiple people questioning him about why this works and how that works and all that -- and then there's your pure researcher who knows the same spells and learned them the same way, but who doesn't have that same deep understanding or constant questioning and has only his own viewpoint to go with.

Of those two, who is more likely to come up with something new?

Candlekeep Forums Moderator

Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!

Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 03 Sep 2020 23:00:50
Go to Top of Page

Rinaldo
Acolyte

USA
10 Posts

Posted - 04 Sep 2020 :  03:38:30  Show Profile Send Rinaldo a Private Message  Reply with Quote
An interesting debate, but anyway, here's the College of Divinity

College of Divinity
Faculty of the Ars Notoria
Department of Magical Ethics
Department of Holy Magic (Clerical Magic)
Department of Philosophy
Department of Arcane Theology (Gods of Magic)
Department of Diviane Theology (other Gods)
Department of Metaphysics (Study of the Weave)
Department of Canon Law (the Magebond and Religious Law)

Nobody had any idea of the prestige classes that would be taught at this university?
Go to Top of Page

sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
11686 Posts

Posted - 04 Sep 2020 :  15:47:53  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

It's one thing to have a novice listen to your ideas. Its another thing to have someone of a similar skill level but different focus listen to your ideas. Granted, there doesn't necessarily be a designated "design" department. It might be something to just have a periodic group meeting to discuss what projects people are working on, and certain people at the university might be designated to be part of a committee to make that happen between departments.




I'm not talking about having a novice listen to ideas. I'm saying that an instructor is going to have to know their stuff backwards and forwards to be able to teach it -- and students aren't going to have the same perspective, so they're likely to come up with the questions that make the instructor think "Hmm, I wonder if that's possible..."

So you've got that instructor, with a deeper understanding of magic and multiple people questioning him about why this works and how that works and all that -- and then there's your pure researcher who knows the same spells and learned them the same way, but who doesn't have that same deep understanding or constant questioning and has only his own viewpoint to go with.

Of those two, who is more likely to come up with something new?



Wooly, reread what I wrote. A "research" department doesn't need to be a dedicated group, but it could be a group whose goal is to listen to what different groups are doing and then extrapolate from that that there might be synergies that can be accomplished or possibly see a thread of an idea that department X is working on that department Y should hear about so they can think on something similar. It comes down to people being different in how they think and learn and interact. Some of the people in department X will likely be so focused on what they're doing that they effectively sit with blinders on focusing on the things that are coming their way. They may be brilliant at that thing. Other people may be less focused and technically inclined, but more social and able to understand things at a high level, and thus able to communicate between groups. To equate this to IT, it would be like the active directory group, the desktop group, the voice group, the network engineers, and the mainframe group all being in a meeting. They all may know their specialty, and it all focuses on computing, but they don't communicate well, and so a lot of times, they need someone with some cross talent to come up with ideas that incorporate pieces from the various specialties.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
Go to Top of Page

cpthero2
Great Reader

USA
2285 Posts

Posted - 17 Sep 2020 :  19:41:15  Show Profile  Visit cpthero2's Homepage Send cpthero2 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Acolyte Rinaldo,

I would consider the following, which is a smattering of what other keepers of lore have offered here within and my own material.

If you're going to have a floating enclave, I would strike a deal with Halruaa. Have it parked right at the shoreline between Lath and Halarahh. As a part of that arrangement, have a mutual defense pact negotiated between Halruaa, and other friendly, powerful nations that could quickly come to the aid of Halruaa. In exchange for said aid, they would naturally have access to the University as well. Having the most powerful Diviner on the planet on site is certainly a help in portending issues, as well as the rest of that super powerful nation of wizards, etc. Netyarch Zalathorm Kirkson is a level 20 Diviner, in addition to his 4 levels of Loremaster and 5 levels of Halruaan Elder. He even punks Gromph Baenre as a Diviner...

Also consider using whatever information is in the scrolls to start positively impacting economic trade for those nations that come to join the mutual aid organization. It helps maintain a greater incentive to be a part of the organization, which comes along with plenty of rules to ensure everything stays on the up and up, going forward.

Have a multi-national council of rulers (one from each joined nation), that rule democratically to have the location of the enclave as an exclusionary zone, such as the United Nations campus in New York.

Then control access to the library in much the same manner as the Vatican allows for access to its vaults of information. I would just look up what they do, and add some magic-sauce to it. ;)

Either way, having that kind of sought after lore in a location is going to bring the pain, regardless. Thay is going to go after that like they have 5 minutes to live. Szass Tam, if he had a mouth to drool with, would be drooling forever.

Best regards,




Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring
Go to Top of Page

redking
Learned Scribe

131 Posts

Posted - 15 Apr 2022 :  04:12:40  Show Profile Send redking a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Why bother with "where" in the spacial sense when you have magic? Make it like the old Gygax short story, Odd Alley, Weird Way.

https://mystical-trash-heap.blogspot.com/2020/05/facts-about-odd-alley-and-weird-way.html

Your university has various access points from around the world, leading to a demiplane that houses the grounds of the college.
Go to Top of Page

Delnyn
Senior Scribe

USA
883 Posts

Posted - 16 Apr 2022 :  17:52:15  Show Profile Send Delnyn a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

Unless you hire a person to research one spell and one spell only, they're going to be dividing their focus.

You're better off going with the person who knows his spells backwards and forwards and can teach it to others, rather than hiring some yahoo who may not know it as well.



Based upon my firsthand experiences in graduate school, I strongly assert subject matter expertise and teaching to others are two very different skills. The super-duper scholar can get bogged down in covering every little nuance that happens to pop up in the original discourse. The student will likely get totally lost and deem the scholar the true yahoo.

The practical instructor who does not know the spell nearly as well as the aforementioned scholar will not digress into all the details. Therefore, they teach only what the student needs to know to cast the spell, no matter how sloppy the scholar may view the casting.
Go to Top of Page

Delnyn
Senior Scribe

USA
883 Posts

Posted - 16 Apr 2022 :  18:48:48  Show Profile Send Delnyn a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I wonder how the organization is coming along, assuming it hasn't been summarily obliterated. Mystra watches the Nether Scrolls like a hawk. If she suspects somebody is going down "the Karsus path", she will smack down with the banhammer. It is a matter of life-or-death for Mystra after all.
Go to Top of Page

Steven Schend
Forgotten Realms Designer & Author

USA
1705 Posts

Posted - 19 Apr 2022 :  17:32:18  Show Profile  Visit Steven Schend's Homepage Send Steven Schend a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rinaldo

The enclave just has too many advantages to ignore. One, it's going to put us on the map, for good or for ill. Yeah, it's going to attract enemies, but it's also going to attract potential students and teachers, as well as other staff. The quasi-magical infrastructure is intact, so we have water, plumbing,lighting, heating, and cooling, all of which will save us a ton of money trying to build it ourselves. The enclave will hold parts of all the colleges, but mainly the Lore College and Bardic College, as well as an aerial stables and skyship port (the enclave is 200 acres and can hold 2,000 people comfortably). We weren't going to fly it over any cities (unless we have to). I asked the GM about the Shadovar attacking, but he just made a joke about moving to "Shady Acres" (the bad side of town), so who knows.



One option to think on is to bring the Enclave into Realmspace up among the Tears of Selune; be sure to plant air-generating trees and plants to sustain the atmosphere, but once in place/orbit, it will only bother those who're up there already.

Just a thought…and given the powers you're already talking about in play with your campaign, it'd be easy enough to build a portal from said school/enclave down to an access point in the Realms NOT in one of the major cities (many of which are warded/shielded from portal activity not already entrenched).

Steven Schend
who thinks he'd LOVE to go to school in space instead of some mundane city in Faerun…

For current projects and general natter, see www.steveneschend.com
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Previous Page
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Candlekeep Forum © 1999-2024 Candlekeep.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000