| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| KarelSoel |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 17:33:33
I've been playing Neverwinter lately and I'm enjoying it, so I'd like to read some other stories taking place in that universe. However, as I know from other fandoms and their books (Star Trek, Star Wars, WoW), the novels can often be mediocre and sometimes downright terrible.
Are there any good Forgotten Realms novels? I don't want to read any old crap because it has D&D on the cover. I want to read a good novel/series that also happens to take place in Forgotten Realms. I notice that the Reddit best-of list has Salvatore's Dark Elf series, and I've already picked that up.
Thanks in advance.
Mod Edit: Link removed, banhammer dropped. Should've realized this was another of those delayed spams. I'm leaving the topic, though, since it has come up before. |
| 24 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Irennan |
Posted - 27 Jan 2022 : 23:47:55
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Again, you really need to stop assuming you know a person's personality just because you've read a few of their books.
And quite probably knows it,in that you are not the first who noticed. Yet cannot avoid this.
It's not a bug, it's a feature. Of the books. Which is what makes them a form of art.
Conflating the writer with their characters is a bug in the reader's brain, if anything. |
| TBeholder |
Posted - 27 Jan 2022 : 22:25:10
Series-wise? Azure Bonds trilogy is a good start, yes. Then series from Elaine Cunningham. Spellfire could be on the list, but it was butchered ludicrously. Elminster Saga eventually turns into flashback mosaic, but even that gives a good view of the setting, including attitudes within it.
quote:
Originally posted by sno4wy
Having read the WoW novels and felt how truly cringe they are, I'd say for the most part, FR novels are much better than that. The exception as a general rule are the Drizzt books, especially the later and more recent ones. The earliest ones are ok, but never as good as some of the other authors out there.
Depends on whether (or how much) "me dumb fighter" dialect makes you wince. Salvatore does have a good scene now and then. But then it ends, and the book must continue, so he just hacks on. Much the same with names. 
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Again, you really need to stop assuming you know a person's personality just because you've read a few of their books.
And quite probably knows it,in that you are not the first who noticed. Yet cannot avoid this.
It's not a bug, it's a feature. Of the books. Which is what makes them a form of art.
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I read a lot of Stephen King, back in the day, and I'm quite confident that he's not some sort of murderous monster.
Well, you never know. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 27 Jan 2022 : 21:28:40
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Again, you really need to stop assuming you know a person's personality just because you've read a few of their books.
I read a lot of Stephen King, back in the day, and I'm quite confident that he's not some sort of murderous monster.
a ghostly voice seems to materialize from nowhere
See Stephen... it's working.... noone would suspect you now. It's time to show them how truly devious you are!
Wait... is that an open mic.... CRRRRAAAAAAAAP |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 27 Jan 2022 : 16:12:37
quote:
Originally posted by Icarium81
I've read nearly every FR novel (as well as dragonlance, ravenloft and 5th age) published, with the exception of anything released in the last 10 years.
The earlier books were subjectively better, but only because they had nothing written prior to contradict anything they put forth.
Hard pass on almost any full length book by Ed greenwood. Having just tried to get back in to the books I used to think so highly of, I can only be blown away by how terrible most of them are. For Ed, every last character is devoid of a consistent personality, the number of ridiculous things characters do or don't do is astonishing.
The plot armor is real thick. Them there's the actual way he writes, he's pretentious to say the least. It's clear he thinks he's better than anyone else, (or maybe he knows he isn't and embraces that) either way, his attempt at having characters talk "old timey" is just a whole lot of repetition of "ye"...ad nauseum. Or "diabolic" if you read elmisnter in hell. The only thing diabolic was that it was ever published.
Even more disturbing is Ed's very clear desire to fk young women. None of the female characters has a personality that makes them do anything other than try to sleep with ancient old wizards....
He claims Mirt is his in realms avatar, so mirt rescues a baby, raises her as a daughter.... then marries her... yup, that's normal. It's also not the only instance where things are glaringly creepy.
#9679;RAS, yes he has many faults in his books, but mostly it's also plot armor heavy. So heavy, that Drizzt out lives all his friends, only to have it effectively retconned by a god bringing them all back to life... how convenient.
I can't recall the majority of the books in any of the realms, but do recall enjoying many of the numbered series.... standalone novels in FR, but that usually encompassed known characters. Ring of winter was one in that series.
Again, you really need to stop assuming you know a person's personality just because you've read a few of their books.
I read a lot of Stephen King, back in the day, and I'm quite confident that he's not some sort of murderous monster. |
| Icarium81 |
Posted - 27 Jan 2022 : 06:29:12
I've read nearly every FR novel (as well as dragonlance, ravenloft and 5th age) published, with the exception of anything released in the last 10 years.
The earlier books were subjectively better, but only because they had nothing written prior to contradict anything they put forth.
Hard pass on almost any full length book by Ed greenwood. Having just tried to get back in to the books I used to think so highly of, I can only be blown away by how terrible most of them are. For Ed, every last character is devoid of a consistent personality, the number of ridiculous things characters do or don't do is astonishing.
The plot armor is real thick. Them there's the actual way he writes, he's pretentious to say the least. It's clear he thinks he's better than anyone else, (or maybe he knows he isn't and embraces that) either way, his attempt at having characters talk "old timey" is just a whole lot of repetition of "ye"...ad nauseum. Or "diabolic" if you read elmisnter in hell. The only thing diabolic was that it was ever published.
Even more disturbing is Ed's very clear desire to fk young women. None of the female characters has a personality that makes them do anything other than try to sleep with ancient old wizards....
He claims Mirt is his in realms avatar, so mirt rescues a baby, raises her as a daughter.... then marries her... yup, that's normal. It's also not the only instance where things are glaringly creepy.
#9679;RAS, yes he has many faults in his books, but mostly it's also plot armor heavy. So heavy, that Drizzt out lives all his friends, only to have it effectively retconned by a god bringing them all back to life... how convenient.
I can't recall the majority of the books in any of the realms, but do recall enjoying many of the numbered series.... standalone novels in FR, but that usually encompassed known characters. Ring of winter was one in that series.
|
| Erikor |
Posted - 02 Sep 2021 : 23:02:23
There are a lot of great series.
Everything Erevis Cale (been mentioned)
The Rage, The Rite, The Ruin. (Series)
Daughter of the drow. (Series)
Azure Bonds (and the rest of the series)
Erin M. Evans' series about Farideh.
That's just some of them.
|
| Gelcur |
Posted - 26 Aug 2021 : 05:20:30
I am not as well read as many of the sages here. But I will make my suggestions:
Spellfire by Ed Greenwood
This book suffered from editors gutting it. I still believe it is the single best introduction to the Forgotten Realms especially for a DM who wants to know how to run it well.
Cormyr: A Novel by Ed Greenwood & Jeff Grubb
You get the learn about a region and its history and a great story at the same time. I love books written by Ed + another author. This actually is part of a 3 book series along with Beyond the High Road by Troy Denning and Death of the Dragon by Ed Greenwood & Troy Denning. I enjoyed the series overall.
City of Splendors by Ed Greenwood & Elaine Cunningham
Great book, Elaine is wonderful and again Ed works well with another author. Ed says Elaine pretty much nails Waterdeep every time she writes a story there and I have to agree.
I have not read any R.A. Salvatore but my understanding is if you want to try start with Homeland. Currently I am reading Death Masks by Ed Greenwood and I am enjoying it very much. |
| CorellonsDevout |
Posted - 26 Aug 2021 : 03:12:46
Some of it will depend on what you're interested in, but I always recommend anything by Elaine Cunningham. Good for story and lore. Other recs include the Erevis Cale saga by Paul S Kemp, the Avatar series, Last Mythal trilogy by Richard Baker, Cormyr: A Novel by Jeff Grubb...there are some gems out there. |
| sno4wy |
Posted - 26 Aug 2021 : 02:00:34
^
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I was once in a debate with someone over the relative quality of some books -- I think it may have been the War of the Spider Queen books.
This person's proof that they were good was to point to the number of copies sold.
I responded that if that was the only measurement, then the 50 Shades books had to have been much, much better.
Oddly, this person did not respond to that one! 
|
| VikingLegion |
Posted - 26 Aug 2021 : 01:40:31
It's popular to dump all over RA Salvatore, most likely because of his overwhelming, almost embarrassing success compared to the rest. His first 6 books though - the Dark Elf trilogy and the Crystal Shard trilogy are terrific. Yes, the quality does tail off at some point, but don't be dissuaded from his earliest works.
The early Grubb/Novak books have a sterling reputation on this forum but I find them too goofy. The plot and setup is amazing, but Grubb just can't help himself from joking around far too frequently. If these were my introduction to the Realms novels I probably would've stopped right there.
Elaine Cunningham is among the best character developers you will find and her books, even the lesser ones, are still better than 85% of the rest of the line.
Paul S. Kemp joins the stable a lot later down the road but I found myself eagerly awaiting his next entries in my reading lists. I put him right up there amongst the top of hierarchy.
There are a whole bunch of other hidden gems to be found littered all up and down the FR collection, but you're getting plenty of opinions here to get you started on your path. |
| Seravin |
Posted - 25 Aug 2021 : 11:48:33
For Swords & Songs, great books. I have issues with Elfshadow as it has a few plot holes, but Elfsong is amazing and among the best. |
| Seravin |
Posted - 25 Aug 2021 : 11:46:30
Grubb/Novak books are excellent. Finder's STone trilogy (Azure Bonds, The Wyvern's Spur and Song of the Saurials). Grubb gets the Realms nearly as well as Ed, but he can craft a well-written story which I think Ed struggles with at times due to being restrained by editors to keep the length readable.
Harpers Series also has some gems (The Ring of Winter my particular favourite).
The Simbul's Gift is just amazing if you like Thay and want to know about how the Zulkirs interact and govern.
|
| Captain Grafalcon |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 15:55:42
Most Realms novels are good. In a universe of nearly 300 novels, the result is better than expected. I don't share the negative opinion about RAS books. They´re very entertaining and the first ones were a consistent entry point for many into the Realms. I suggest reading the anthologies, which allow you to know some authors and their most relevant characters. Realms of Infamy and Realms of Valor, for instance, are excellent. |
| BenN |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 09:16:31
As well as those mentioned above, I really like the Shadowbane series by Erik Scott de Bie. No Mary Sues, no Realms-Shaking-Events, and the vivid characters really bring the Realms to life.
I also liked a lot of the characters in the Return of the Archwizards trilogy by Troy Denning. |
| nblanton |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 03:36:35
Oddly no one has suggested a novel by the creator of the Realms, but I'll say that Spellfire by Ed Greenwood is a great place to start you're journey into Realms fiction. I may skip the Elminster novels until you're better acquainted with the setting though. They are more akin to trying to start in Tolkien's world by reading the Silmarillion cold (this is an exaggeration, but still, I'm not sure I would have enjoyed reading Elminster: Making of Mage had I not been actively playing and reading FR fiction for years.)
Elaine Cunningham is by far a better author, I don't think anyone is going to argue that. I'll agree with most and say to skip RA Salvatore, unless you want to read RA Salvatore, which is fine, but as weird as it sounds, he's not really a Realms author in my opinion.
Also, whatever you do, don't read the novelization of the Baldur's Gate game. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 01:46:11
-Depends on what you like I guess. |
| Delnyn |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 01:20:24
Take the Lady Penitent series with a grain of salt. |
| HighOne |
Posted - 24 Aug 2021 : 00:48:54
quote:
Originally posted by KarelSoel
I notice that the Reddit best-of list has Salvatore's Dark Elf series, and I've already picked that up.
Homeland is still the best Forgotten Realms book ever written, in my opinion. It's also chronologically the first Drizzt/Dark Elf book, so I would start there.
Elaine Cunningham's Songs & Swords series is also good. |
| deserk |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 22:56:30
You're not gonna be sorry reading Elaine Cunningham's FR books. I thoroughly enjoyed them and I feel she really manages to depict the Realms in a really lively, colourful and authentic way. Both a great novelist and also very respectful of the lore.
I haven't read all FR novels, but I've read a few others as well, and I got to say, I mostly prefer the ones that don't have this wild crazy stuff going on (demon, planar invasions, etc.). Focus on character development, an interesting setting with relatively mild and local threats to the characters or the environment.
I liked the first two War of the Spider Queens book since they felt like a simple sword and sorcery adventure in the Underdark (particularly the chapters that focused on the buddy/enemy relationship of Ryld the drow warrior and Pharaun the drow wizard). But the books that come after I like less, since things start to get more explosive and exhaustive...
The Last Mythal, centred around the Daemonfey elves was also another good and entertaining novel series.
RAS' work imo varies a bit in it's quality. It is certainly popcorn entertainment, but often I don't like the implications the happenings of his books have on the setting as a whole. Particularly his latest book. Disregarding the new "drow communities", I don't like for instance what has happened to Luskan, which seems to have devolved into a happy little Bregan D'aerthe colony, as opposed to being one of the most notorious city states of the North, site of some of the most powerful pirate clans, as well as the headquarters of the mysterious Arcane Brotherhood. It had a very interesting role in 2nd and 3rd edition lore imo, and had a bit of an adversarial relationship in the setting against the civilizing forces of "good" in the setting of North; always causing trouble with cities like Neverwinter and Waterdeep. Now it's kind of been really mellowed out into this very boring and bland city. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 22:44:38
I was once in a debate with someone over the relative quality of some books -- I think it may have been the War of the Spider Queen books.
This person's proof that they were good was to point to the number of copies sold.
I responded that if that was the only measurement, then the 50 Shades books had to have been much, much better.
Oddly, this person did not respond to that one! |
| sno4wy |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 22:23:06
Having read the WoW novels and felt how truly cringe they are, I'd say for the most part, FR novels are much better than that. The exception as a general rule are the Drizzt books, especially the later and more recent ones. The earliest ones are ok, but never as good as some of the other authors out there. I would recommend Elaine Cunningham's Starlight & Shadows trilogy, as well as Richard Baker's The Last Mythal and Blades of the Moonsea trilogies. Paul Kemp's Erevis Cale books are very well-liked, and while for me they weren't the most grabbing, I do feel that they're pretty well-written and would recommend them. |
| TomCosta |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 19:08:30
For my part, I'm inclined to agree with the posts above. I'll add Paul Kemp. Elaine Cunningham and Paul Kemp are probably the two most consistently excellent Realms authors that have written more than a few books. Novak and Grubb's books were also very good. Salvatore's first 15-20 Drizzt novels were good and fine and he created some very compelling characters but the writing isn't as solid as the others IMO. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 18:33:12
For my money, Azure Bonds, by Kate Novak and Jeff Grubbs, or Elfshadow, by Elaine Cunningham, are the places to start. These are far and away some of the best books we've ever gotten for the Realms, and both do far more to showcase the setting than just about anything by any other Realms author. |
| Gary Dallison |
Posted - 23 Aug 2021 : 17:54:40
I would recommend not reading the salvatore novels unless you are a teenager filled with angst and insecurity.
If you have a more discerning taste in what you read then I would suggest the Wyvernspur (although it is the second in the series so you might want to read the equally good azure bonds first). |
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