| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Strixy1374 |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 04:21:43
I am in search of ancient lore and the great library of Google has failed me. I come seeking guidance on spell previously known to be in a cursed volume called the Priests Spell Compendium of 2E. The spell in question is called "Detect Drow" and purports to be castable by both a dwarf and gnome. Logical until you realize it says it is granted by Shevarash, who is most definitely elven. My first thought was that it should have been written "Elf, Gnome" but it seemed far more logical to me that the listed God was wrong. Could any of the wise and knowledgable shed some light on this? I thank Thee for thy time. |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| CorellonsDevout |
Posted - 26 Sep 2020 : 21:16:03
Shevarash in particular hates drow. His followers are devoted to hunting them down. |
| Compaste |
Posted - 23 Sep 2020 : 07:24:39
So I would rule this spell is certainly available to elven (and half-elven) priests. |
| TheIriaeban |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 17:04:27
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
There is Detect Dwarf in the 2e PSCVI so there is at least one other variation. Image you are a dwarf and you suspect that there is a drow that has infiltrated your stronghold. Your detect intelligent life would be almost useless since it would detect dwarves as well. But, detect drow would allow you to confirm that he/she is there and generally where they are. That would be very useful. Maybe a better general one would be detect enemy (which also exists and is also a spell from the dwarven deities).
Yeah, but my detect intelligent life spell would detect a drow: it's just not a "find one type of creature and only one type of creature" like detect drow. In your scenario, my spell would say "okay, lots of life around you" but then given successful checks or whatever you'd narrow it down to "37 dwarves scattered here, here, here, (and so on) and one drow that's standing 37 paces to your north-northeast."
After all, what good does it do to find the drow in front of you if you don't know about their minotaur slave behind you or their draegloth half-sibling to your right?
That's why I mentioned the detect enemies spell as a better general option. It ignores your buddies and tags all the baddies. Of course, that will also pick up the guy who hates you for when you, just as a joke mind you, cut off most of his beard in his sleep. But, if he gets wacked, well, he had it coming for holding a grudge for such a minor thing. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 16:49:46
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Seems kind of weird, actually... The existence of a spell meant to target a specific race would imply variations of the spell for other races and creatures: detect human, detect non-drow elf, detect gnome, detect duergar, detect troll, detect flumph, detect giant space hamster, detect tarrasque, and so on.
Me, I'd rather a single catchall spell: detect intelligent life, something that detects over say Intelligence 6. A basic success would be "intelligent life in the spell's radius" while more successful castings (spell checks, higher DCs, whatever) would narrow range and critter-type down further: roughly this far away, roughly this far away in this general direction, and specific location, for range, and for the critter-type, biped/non-biped, demihuman/humanoid/something else, broad generalities like "dragon" or "member of an elven race" and then specifics like drow or black dragon.
There is Detect Dwarf in the 2e PSCVI so there is at least one other variation. Image you are a dwarf and you suspect that there is a drow that has infiltrated your stronghold. Your detect intelligent life would be almost useless since it would detect dwarves as well. But, detect drow would allow you to confirm that he/she is there and generally where they are. That would be very useful. Maybe a better general one would be detect enemy (which also exists and is also a spell from the dwarven deities).
Yeah, but my detect intelligent life spell would detect a drow: it's just not a "find one type of creature and only one type of creature" like detect drow. In your scenario, my spell would say "okay, lots of life around you" but then given successful checks or whatever you'd narrow it down to "37 dwarves scattered here, here, here, (and so on) and one drow that's standing 37 paces to your north-northeast."
After all, what good does it do to find the drow in front of you if you don't know about their minotaur slave behind you or their draegloth half-sibling to your right? |
| TheIriaeban |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 15:59:47
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Seems kind of weird, actually... The existence of a spell meant to target a specific race would imply variations of the spell for other races and creatures: detect human, detect non-drow elf, detect gnome, detect duergar, detect troll, detect flumph, detect giant space hamster, detect tarrasque, and so on.
Me, I'd rather a single catchall spell: detect intelligent life, something that detects over say Intelligence 6. A basic success would be "intelligent life in the spell's radius" while more successful castings (spell checks, higher DCs, whatever) would narrow range and critter-type down further: roughly this far away, roughly this far away in this general direction, and specific location, for range, and for the critter-type, biped/non-biped, demihuman/humanoid/something else, broad generalities like "dragon" or "member of an elven race" and then specifics like drow or black dragon.
There is Detect Dwarf in the 2e PSCVI so there is at least one other variation. Image you are a dwarf and you suspect that there is a drow that has infiltrated your stronghold. Your detect intelligent life would be almost useless since it would detect dwarves as well. But, detect drow would allow you to confirm that he/she is there and generally where they are. That would be very useful. Maybe a better general one would be detect enemy (which also exists and is also a spell from the dwarven deities). |
| Strixy1374 |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 15:37:53
I am in agreement with both of you. I've spent many years converting 2e products (I'm a die hard 2E guy) to either word docs or corrected PDFs and have fixed hundreds if not thousands of mistakes. Usually I can find the correct/original info online somewhere. A lot of it here.
Since I can't find the original product/source of the spell I've decided to add Elf and keep Shevarash on the list. If you read his entry in TSR 09585 Demihuman Dieties, his portfolio says "Hatred of the drow". I'm also adding in Gorm Gulthyn. Thanks again. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 15:24:20
Seems kind of weird, actually... The existence of a spell meant to target a specific race would imply variations of the spell for other races and creatures: detect human, detect non-drow elf, detect gnome, detect duergar, detect troll, detect flumph, detect giant space hamster, detect tarrasque, and so on.
Me, I'd rather a single catchall spell: detect intelligent life, something that detects over say Intelligence 6. A basic success would be "intelligent life in the spell's radius" while more successful castings (spell checks, higher DCs, whatever) would narrow range and critter-type down further: roughly this far away, roughly this far away in this general direction, and specific location, for range, and for the critter-type, biped/non-biped, demihuman/humanoid/something else, broad generalities like "dragon" or "member of an elven race" and then specifics like drow or black dragon. |
| TheIriaeban |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 15:11:10
Vol 1 of the 2e Priest's Spell Compendium has it listed for Dwarf,Gnome and has this:
"Notes: Granted by the dwarven god Shevarash, and by the gnome god Callarduran Smoothhands"
As you mentioned, Shevarash is elven so the proper dwarven god, in my opinion, would seem to be Gorm Gulthyn. His portfolio is: Guardian and protector of all dwarves. dwarven guardians, defense, watchfulness, vigilance, duty. It also makes sense to change that to Dwarf, Elf, Gnome and to just add in Gorm as another source. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 07 Sep 2020 : 07:49:33
D&D rulebooks are always full of typos. Especially the older editions, before they routinely worked with software tools which could spellcheck. Especially the 2E splatbooks, when they were churning as much stuff as they could as fast as they could, some of these had large loosely-edited copypasta passages which faithfully replicated the same errors contained in the originals.
Many AD&D-era books were quietly revised. The core rulebooks and core setting books often had multiple printings. Not to mention endless mountains of errata which used to be appended online.
It seems logical for an elven deity to grant this spell. Elves have always hated drow, it's a prominent and uninterrupted theme in all their mythos.
So I would rule this spell is certainly available to elven (and half-elven) priests.
And because it's a tool which could thwart the elven racial enemy - because drow threaten all races - it seems logical for the elven deity to also allow all non-drow races access to the spell.
Dwarven and gnomish priests could indeed make obvious use of this spell, at least if they're Underdark inhabitants. So they could easily have developed their own versions of the same thing, identical in every way (more or less, within game terms) except granted by their own racial deities. I can't imagine dwarven priests relying on elven gods to cover the defiencies of dwarven gods. And it seems like a comparatively simple magic, not unlike detect evil or detect undead, which anyone could devise. |
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