| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Dinnin |
Posted - 01 Aug 2012 : 01:56:38
Hey Guys
ive read the neverwinter series so far, and just wondering what books are out to read more about thay and Szas Tam.
thanks |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 14 Nov 2012 : 05:26:05
I figured after looking at all this, it might be worth the time to make a timeline. Again, most of the below is homebrew. If you like it, enjoy.
-???? DR Murghos the Imaskari anima mage becomes a powerful necromancer, focusing his research on the magic of undead spirits and soul entrapment.
-???? DR Murghos the Imaskari anima mage crafts the Staff of the Necromancer.
-???? DR Murghos the Imaskari anima mage transforms himself into a lich using his Staff of the Necromancer as his phylactery.
-???? DR Murghos the Imaskari anima mage seeks to become a powerful demi-lich, but something goes wrong with the ritual. His sentience becomes entrapped inside of his phylactery, the Staff of the Necromancer, as his remaining body, a jeweled skull, becomes fused with the staff. The staff changes from being a standard lich's phylactery into a vestige phylactery and the staff becomes an Imaskari artifact that becomes known as "The Skull Staff of the Necromancer".
-???? DR Thayd, a powerful Imaskari anima mage, begins exploring other Crystal Spheres and bringing back knowledge of their magical systems to the Imaskari Empire.
-???? DR Thayd, a powerful Imaskari anima mage, makes contact with a multi-spheric group of binders known as the Theurgian Society. This group of binders, like the Imaskari, believe that the gods are just powerful beings and not worthy of worship. Also, both groups believe that the quest for knowledge should not be filtered through divine eyes if the truth is to be found. As a result, both groups are considered Heathens.
-???? DR with the aid of Thayd and other Imaskari, as well as beings from several other prime worlds, the Theurgian Library is formed.
-2488 DR the incarnation of Horus slays Lord Artificer Yuvaraj, Emperor of Imaskar, signalling the fall of the Imaskar Empire.
-2488 DR Thayd is alerted via spell to the fall of the capital city of Imaskar whilst making notes within the Theurgian Library in a personal journal. He returns to aid his fellow Imaskari, but he is instead trapped by a symbol of Imprisonment.
-1110 DR a member of the Theurgian Society, Taelos, comes across Thayd's personal journal in the Theurgian Library, which had been preserved magically. Thinking to uncover many powerful artifacts of lost Imaskar, he travels to Toril and discovers the trap holding Thayd captive. The Theurgian then frees Thayd using a spell of Freedom. Over the next 5 years, Thayd and this Taelos work together to rediscover much lost lore and magic of ancient Imaskar.
-1105 DR Thayd recovers the "Skull Staff of the Necromancer" and other powerful Imaskari artifacts from within the fallen city of Inupras.
-1101 DR Thayd and Taelos begin recruiting disgruntled arcanists within the Mulhorandi Empire into a new society which they called "the Theurgist Adepts". Their guiding principle is that knowledge should be sought and that the theocracy should not block research. The Theurgist Adepts are taught much lore on the planes, necromancy, summoning and binding beings, creation of constructs, and powerful elemental assaults.
-1098 DR Thayd makes contact with the mausoleum city, Pholzubbalt, which contains many arcanists who share the same views as the Theurgist Adepts. The two groups begin working together secretly.
-1096 DR the wizard, Ythazz Buvaar, who would later help found the country of Thay, joins the Theurgist Adepts.
-1094 DR The Theurgist Adepts, at the direction of Thayd, build a keyed portal to another prime world filled with religiously zealous orcs (the key required to open it being the "Skull Staff of the Necromancer"). The adepts begin gathering an army of slave workers by invading this world and taking the children in a series of lightning raids. These orc children are trained harshly, and any that show a religious devotion are killed. Adult orcs are either outright slain and re-animated or brought back to be sacrificed to secure the aid of powerful outsiders. No bodies are left behind at the raided settlements and the keyed portal is hidden by powerful illusions and protected by bound baatezu servitors and other powerful spells.
-1087 DR The Theurgist adepts begin open rebellion on a large scale against the Theocracies of Mulhorand and Unther
-1086 DR Ythazz Buvaar leads a successful raid using undead and demons against the armies of Mulhorand. Ythazz becomes a major leader amongst the Theurgist Adepts.
-1084 DR Ythazz Buvaar successfully completes the ritual to become a lich.
-1081 DR The Theurgist adepts are defeated by the armies of Unther and Mulhorand. The incarnations of the Mulan deities specifically work together to hunt down Thayd. In a running fight lasting several days, Thayd slowly works through his many caches of resources until ultimately he attempts a last ditch effort to save his life. Casting a contingent effect that will allow his soul to transfer into the vestige phylactery portion of the Skull Staff of the Necromancer upon death, he hopes his other contingent effects will whisk his body and staff to another safehold where his body will be repaired by simulacrums so that he can then return to it. Unfortunately, the incarnations of the Mulan Gods carry a weirdstone which blocks all magical transportation with them and upon dying Thayd is transferred into the Skull Staff of the Necromancer, and the next day his spirit becomes entrapped as a vestige.
-1077 DR Taelos of the Theurgian Society and other Theurgist Adepts recover the Skull Staff of the Necromancer from the God-Kings of Mulhorand. Using it they plan to raise an army of orc soldiers from the other prime world. Exactly what happens to the Theurgists is unknown, but the orcs discover the portal between worlds and the truth behind the slaughter of their settlements. They also come into possession of the Skull Staff of the Necromancer and gain control of the portal, which becomes known as the "Orcgate".
-1076 DR to -1069 DR the orcgate wars occur.
-1069 DR the orcgate is destroyed, the burst of magical energy causes the Skull Staff of the Necromancer to be transferred to the astral plane where it is lost.... for a time.
-1069 DR Cloaking his lichdom in illusion, Ythazz Buvaar flees to Shaundalar where he trades lost Imaskari books on portal magic in return for a large estate in the countryside.
-1064 DR A two-way portal between the Shandaular, capital of the kingdom of Ashanath and Council Hills, far to the south in the Eastern Shaar, is opened.
-949 DR Ythazz Buvaar becomes allied with the Nentyarch of Tharos and begins aiding the Nars discreetly
-946 DR The armies of the Nentyarch of Tharos destroy Shandaular. The empire of Narfell is formed.
-623 DR Ythazz Buvaar convinces Nentyarch Ulthas "the Darkwing" Orgolath, ruler of the Narfell empire, to assault Mulhorand and Unther. Ulthas is slain in the battle and the crown is passed to his brother, Ulthar "the Darkhorn" Orgolath. Ythazz Buvaar is slain in battle with Osirian priests and his ship is sank. Ythazz's phylactery is captured by sahuagin who use it as blackmail to enslave the lich. Ythazz is trapped beneath the ocean with no access to his spellbooks nor means to create a new one and only those spells that his sahuagin captors see fit to let him memorize at any given time.
-579 DR With the aid of a captured sea elf, Ythazz Buvaar recovers his phylactery and annihilates his sahuagin tormentors.
sometime between -483 and -352 DR (might need research) the Narfellian archmage, Mellifleur, attempts a modified ritual of endless night to become a lich. At the same time, Bane is attempting to infuse his divine power into a banelich. Some kind of divine accident occurs and Mellifleur becomes the god of lichdom. The Netherese archmage Karsus learns of this accident in the coming years and becomes obsessed with the idea of becoming a god through arcane means. Ythazz Buvaar, being a lich, knows of the ascension of this mortal being that he'd considered a menial wizard and spends the next millenia trying to uncover the secrets of the ritual amongst other research.
-342 DR The Netherese Archmage Larloch also hears stories of the "divine accident" that created Mellifleur. He also hears of Karsus' research and flies his enclave, Jiksidur, to Narfell so that he may see if he can uncover any clues to the ritual Mellifleur performed.
-339 DR Karsus' Folly. Many things happen, but amongst them, the lich Ythazz Buvaar is destroyed and his spirit entrapped within his phylactery
717 DR The wizard Velsharoon Jathlet of Halruaa embarks upon an ill fated sea voyage to Zakhara that ends with himself being shipwrecked upon the isle of Sahu, also known as the Isle of the Necromancer King, Uruk Kigal. Being a mage, Velsharoon is enslaved to serve the Necromancer King rather than killed. While there, Velsharoon begins secretly studying the strange arts of the "dread necromancer" which are similar to but different from his own arcane studies.
722 DR Velsharoon escapes the isle of Sahu and returns home to Halruaa.
735 DR Velsharoon and several other disillusioned Halruaan wizards form a clandestine organization that they term "the red wizards" whose stated goal is to study magic that their fellow Halruaans would otherwise suppress. They meet in secret and setup a private library of shared lore.
753 DR Chessentan adventurers uncover the phylactery of Ythazz Buvaar in Thesk and think it an art object and return home with it. Velsharoon, visiting the city on business, recognizes that the object contains the spirit of a powerful being and buys the phylactery with the intention of studying it
755 DR Velsharoon frees Ythazz Buvaar from his phylactery but only after communing with the lich and using his necromantic knowledge to help develop a ritual to transfer his life force from one body to another. Ythazz Buvaar spends the next few years attuning himself to the new changes in the weave since the death of Mystryl. Ythazz joins the red wizards organization in Halruaa
763 DR Velsharoon sets up a second home in Delzimmer and puts a concubine in charge of the household. He takes advantage of his young body and fathers several children upon the woman but spends little time helping raise them. He does however provide a small fortune to them in the form of magic items which are promptly sold in the markets for good profit. Over the next few centuries, the Jathlet family becomes prominent in Delzimmer and maintains polite if distant contact with their progenitor. Velsharoon continues to use his family over the years to fence stolen objects and other nefarious deeds.
770 DR to 800 DR - the red wizards in Halruaa continue to grow. Meanwhile, their delvings move slowly eastward and northward, into old Imaskari, Narfellian, and Raumathari ruins. Some members, including Velsharoon, begun study of the lost Imaskari art of binding. Velsharoon learns that Thayd is a vestige and with Ythazz Buvaar's aid learns to bind him.
818 DR Velsharoon and Ythazz Buvaar agree to aid the drow of T'lindhet by providing spies within Dambrath. In return, they request access to captured spellbooks and books on magical theory, especially necromancy.
827 DR The wizard Omm Hlandrar of Halruaa engages a Red Wizard named Velsharoon in a spectacular magical battle in the skies over the Shaar. The contest ends in a draw
sometime between 827 DR and 922 DR - the red wizards leave Halruaa and move to the priador where they eventually instigate the uprising that forms the country of Thay. Did Ythazz Buvaar contact the mages of Pholzubbalt to join the revolution? Zhengyi joins the red wizards (where he was from, unknown). Jorgmacdon learns of Eltab and his bindings and much Narfellian lore and joins the red wizards.
sometime between 922 DR and 1074 DR Zhengyi and Velsharoon both turn renegade
sometime after that, Velsharoon builds his "Tower Terrible" in Soorenar, pisses off the archmage Halder of Delzimmer for some reason, and becomes an enemy of Szass Tam
1358 DR the Time of Troubles. Mellifleur takes a lich as an avatar but is destroyed and is entrapped within his phylactery. Ao does not free him. It may be that Larloch unwittingly destroyed Mellifleur.
1368 DR Velsharoon becomes a deity utilizing the "Phylactery of Mellifleur" and the "Skull Staff of the Necromancer" and a special ritual which sends Mellifleur's essence to the place where Vestiges go. Velsharoon then enacts a lich creation ritual that pulls the divine energy from the Phylactery of Mellifleur into his person. As a deity, Velsharoon continues to use his "binding" arts to make pacts with vestiges, only they're more willing to grant more power in exchange for the chance to share the perceptions of a deity. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 23:21:05
Oooo, and just rereading through the history I had written about how Thayd became a Vestige (through a dangerous use of a vestige phylactery in a last ditch effort to save his life).... then correlating it with the history I wrote up for the Skull Staff of the Necromancer and that it acts as a vestige phylactery.... then factoring in that Velsharoon recovered the Skull Staff of the Necromancer (which was an Imaskari artifact).... I'm going to throw out the idea that Thayd once possessed Velsharoon's "Skull Staff of the Necromancer" and it was his last ditch effort with said device that turned him into a vestige. Further, I'll conjecture that Thayd was the one who gave the idea of transferring Mellifleur's personality from "the phylactery of Mellifleur" into the vestige phylactery of the "Skull Staff of the Necromancer". |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 23:07:04
Oh yeah, one other idea that we were throwing around was that Thayd had actually become a vestige and that Velsharoon had been rediscovering binding (as an anima mage) from Imaskari lore, and that he'd been channeling Thayd.... and in fact several of the "red wizards" that rose up against Mulhorand were binders who also were channeling Thayd. In the internal scuffles that consolidated the rule of Zulkirs that lasted 152 years following the nations foundation, these binders were decimated or fled. Again, totally homebrew, but makes for a decent idea with multiple individuals getting guidance from Thayd's vestige during the actual uprising against Mulhorand.
Below is the link where I had written up the vestige rules, history, explained the mistake he'd made that turned him into a vestige, etc.... It has a pretty interesting and nasty special effect for anima mages that they'll either love or fear, as it gives DM's some minimal control of them.
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15785 |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 22:59:56
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Oh yeah, one other idea that we were throwing around was that Thayd had actually become a vestige and that Velsharoon had been rediscovering binding (as an anima mage) from Imaskari lore, and that he'd been channeling Thayd.... and in fact several of the "red wizards" that rose up against Mulhorand were binders who also were channeling Thayd. In the internal scuffles that consolidated the rule of Zulkirs that lasted 152 years following the nations foundation, these binders were decimated or fled. Again, totally homebrew, but makes for a decent idea with multiple individuals getting guidance from Thayd's vestige during the actual uprising against Mulhorand.
Heh. I kind of like it. I miss the old mulhorandi Pantheon :(
2e was fun times for the godkings |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 22:36:59
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Ahhh interesting. The original Zulkir's.
Somehow I doubt if they have been gone this long that they are coming back or have real interest in Thay anymore. Even if they were puppet mastering for centuries, they probably would have revealed themselves when Tam's war was tearing the place apart.
But yes, certainly if a bunch of casters of that age and power suddenly came back and wanted to take over, it would give anyone pause.
Generally, it seems in the realms that the big bad's and big goods of beyond epic levels don't tangle with each other all that often. Especially in the abodes of those they are tangling with.
Actually, we do know that the original Zulkir, Ythazz Buvaar, is still around from Spellbound. He's just trapped below Bezantur. Now whether that extends the 100 years after the spellplague, can't say.
"The most powerful resident of the tombs is the ancient
Zulkir Ythazz Buvaar, one of the founders of the modem
nation of Thay. Unknown to those modem zulkirs who
have forgotten Ythazz and his contributions, the zulkir
lives on, still clinging to the elaborate throne upon
which his embalmed body once sat. He is now a demilich,
but his life force is such that he still schemes to
return and visit terrible vengeance upon those Thayans
who do not honor his memory. Currently he seeks a mortal
body to inhabit, and he sends his various minions#151;
vampires, wights, ghosts, and lesser forms of undead#151;
forth to obtain a suitable victim. So far all candidates
have proved unworthy, dying of fright or other stresses
well before Ythazz can steal their mortal bodies."
I remember that name from spellbound, although I almost forgot it. That book came out later than Ed's 1991 post about the founder "Thayd" and his cabal of Zulkir's so we can assume his name is that of the true founder since it is more recent.
Another possible tie in to this "Szass Tam was a hidden power behind the founding of Thay" which he gives us an NDA about because someone from TSR has taken that material for a story.
You're mixing up Lore. Thayd was the head of the Theurgist Adepts, which fell about two millenia prior. He was one of the last Imaskari and he challenged the Mulan Empires (specifically Mulhorand). Right after his death, the Orcgates opened.
Thayd was not a founder of Thay, but Ythazz used his name as a rememberance of the last set of non-theist magic-users to rise up against the Theocracy of Mulhorand.
I had gathered a lot of this information together in the below thread.
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6087
Note, the list of "original zulkirs" that Ed gave out at some Con years ago also disagrees with the statement in dreams of the red wizards that Jorgmacdon was the original Zulkir of Conjuration. Just a note for those doing the research. Jorgmacdon is confirmed again as being heavily involved in the freeing of Thay in Crimson Gold where they discuss Ythaaz Buvaar and his uprising.
Nah. Not mixing up lore. Just quoting that Ed post from 91, alot of which has changed since obviously. in that post, Ed stated Thayd was the founder and the Zulkir' his circle of trusted loyals.
obviously, things have changed. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 22:35:18
At one point, I'd also made some conjectures on the history of Thayd and Ythazz Buvaar. In THEORY, it could easily be re-written that Ythazz was actually a new name that Thayd hid out under. My preference though is to keep the two separate, because if Thayd was all powerful back then... and he's had another 2400 years to grow..... he should be a devastating power. I prefer Ythazz to be on a power level near Tam's and actually weaker. Thus, this totally homebrew history below. I wrote it a few years ago, so I'm betting if I were to go through it, there may be some sections I'd change.... but I think it holds some decent ideas.
Ythazz had been part of the original uprising in Mulhorand in -1087 DR by the Theurgist Adept Thayd (put to death -1081). That uprising had been about the god-kings controlling the studies of the wizards of the Mulhorandi Empire. Thayd was killed, but Ythazz was one of the few surviving conspirators who fled. A few years later the Orcgate opened, which threw Mulhorand into yet another conflict (whether Ythazz had something to do with the Orcgate opening is doubtful due to his relative power at the time, however there are rumors that escaped “Thaydists” were involved in the opening of the Orcgates).
After the Orcgate wars, the country of Narfell formed when refugee mercenaries from the orcgate wars returned home. The Narfellians were similar in belief to the followers of Thayd that magical research should be allowed to take its own course. While many of the Narfellians turned to the arts of conjuration and consorting with planar allies for their powers, others turned to the black arts of necromancy. This proved the perfect environment for the young lich, Ythazz, and he gathered a group of like minded spellcasters amongst the Nars. Ythazz was able to secure a small realm for himself along the coast of what is modern day Thesk, from which he trained apprentices in the arts of magical warfare to face off against their enemies in nearby Raumathar. The next few centuries passed in relative peace, with Ythazz spending much time researching and experimenting upon captured subjects to see what new monstrosities he could make. After a time, as with all megalomaniacs, he began to think he was undefeatable, and he convinced his fellow Narfellians that the path to greatness lay in seizing the weakened empires of Mulhorand and Unther.
So, the Nars formed a fleet of ships with the intention of sailing down and capturing the coast of Mulhorand and Unther and from there launching attacks upon the newly formed Raumathari city of Kensten. Unfortunately, the Nars had overestimated the combined power of the elder empires, and the fleet of Narfell never even made landfall. Ythazz was destroyed by the priests of Osiris in a fierce spellbattle aboard his own capital ship. The lich’s phylactery sank below the waves, where it was captured by a powerful sahuagin priest. Without his spellbooks, Ythazz was incapable of challenging the sahuagin to recover his soul’s repository. As a result the sahuagin put the lich into service to his tribe creating magic items that they could use or trade to surface worlders. In return, Ythazz was given access to select spells to study that had been recovered from surface world raids. Over time, however, Ythazz was secretly able to gather an intact spellbook, and using it he was able to find and reclaim his phylactery and escape.
Almost half a century had passed before Ythazz had once again returned to the surface world. He returned to Narfell, only to find that one of his enemy’s apprentices, an upstart named Mellifleur, had laid claim to his tower and all of his possessions. What was worse was that Ythazz recognized that this apprentice’s power rivaled his own, especially without access to the centuries of compiled research which he had left behind for security. So, Ythazz set about rebuilding once again, performing raids against both the Raumathari battlemages and Narfellian Demonbinders in order to recover items of art and books of lore.
Despite being a lich, Ythazz was not a master of necromancy, so he never understood the accident that occurred to Mellifleur a century later. However, being a lich, he quickly understood that one of his former compatriots had suddenly ascended into godhood when he discovered that Mellifleur had become the Lord of Liches. Ythazz, already having disdane for the gods because of his time with Thayd, was repulsed by this idea even further because he had held Mellifleur in contempt. The lord of Liches success galled Ythazz, and he spent the next two centuries and vast sums of money trying to uncover the mysteries behind the ritual. Yet for all his efforts, he found himself none the wiser as to what had been the lynchpin to Mellifleur’s ascension. Perhaps with more time, he might have been able to understand it, but time was not on his side. Karsus’ Folly changed the way magic worked throughout the entire world, and Ythazz found his body destroyed in a conflagration of suddenly released magics. Ythazz found himself entrapped in his own phylactery, and he could not escape.
Nearly a millennia passed before his phylactery was recovered by Chessentan adventurers who didn’t recognize it for what it truly was. Selling the phylactery as an art object, the phylactery came into the hands of a southern necromancer by the name of Velsharoon. The necromancer recognized the “art object” for its true nature, and he sought to unlock its mysteries, eventually succeeding. Ythazz found himself free and indebted to Velsharoon. In gratitude, he offered to teach Velsharoon lost mysteries of the art, and in return the necromancer would educate Ythazz in the more modern magical advances as well as the changes in the world.
While he had been entrapped, the world had changed much. The mystical empire of Netheril had fallen, and from its ashes Halruaa had been born in the untamed lands of the south. The great realms of Narfell and Raumathar had mutually fallen, and the empire of Mulhorand had seen a resurgence with the recovery of Raumathari lands. Ythazz found that Mystra had changed the way magic worked following Karsus’ Folly, and thus many of his great secrets were lost to time. Ythazz felt a need to discover and test the thresholds of the art; and he found a kindred spirit within Velsharoon.
The two great mages formed a secret society of like minded researchers who would test the dark arts, gathering to their banner those Halruaan and Mulan mages who chafed under the strictures of their society. They sought the power of their Netherese ancestors, for they would be masters of the world again. Calling themselves “red wizards”, whether for their focus on blood, war, or just boldness, is unknown now. What is known is that they performed experimental atrocities that sickened their fellow Halruaan elders when they discovered them. There were minor scuffles that occurred, but the final straw culminated in 827 DR when Omm Hlandrar brought the fight to Velsharoon in fierce spellbattle above the plains of the Shaar. The battle ended in a draw, but Ythazz and Velsharoon decided it was best to move to more secure surroundings.
The two archmages, along with the remainder of their red wizards, moved to the Priador, a section of Mulhorand which had previously been held variously by Narfellians and Raumatharans. Needless to say, it was a portion of the empire bubbling with rebellion. Ythazz and Velsharoon formed alliances with several new Mulan allies such as the conjurer Jorgmacdon Odesseiron and the Patriarch of the Tam Family. Working from the shadows, through their lesser red wizards, they slowly gathered disaffected Mulan mages from throughout the old empires. Velsharoon worked his way into the government by seizing the body of a young Osirian priest, working as a spy from within.
It was in 922 DR that Ythazz and his red wizards truly began to work against the Mulhorandi, staging an uprising in the Priador’s capital city of Delhumide. 2002 years after the death of Thayd, Ythazz had finally raised up enough power to strike against the church of Mulhorand with the help of his fellow red wizards. The war was quick, ended in the battle of Thazalhar when the red wizard Jorgmacdon did what the Narfellian conjurers had failed to do, summoning and controlling the demon lord Eltab. The red wizards named the country Thay in honor of the long dead "hero" of old and declared that they would not be led by the gods, but by the art of man.
Of course, Ythazz had been prepared for the assault and the destruction. He was not at all prepared for the rebuilding and consolidation required afterwards. Initially, peace ruled as each mage setup their own demesne amongst the conquered land. But this calm was soon replaced by occasional magical assaults, as each mage sought to eliminate their rivals. Ythazz recognized that order must be attained, and he joined with his fellow archmages to strike out against those who would stand against combined rule. He also recognized that his former comrade Velsharoon was now set to usurp his throne from him, and that Velsharoon had gathered his own allies. But, Ythazz’s allies proved to strong and Velsharoon was eventually forced to leave Thay as a consequence of rising up against his fellow red wizards. In the end, Ythazz and his fellows won out, and the council of Zulkirs was formed.
Having won out against the God-Kings, Ythazz turned once again to his researches. Eventually, he discovered the secret to attaining a higher level of lichdom, transforming himself into a demilich. However, in his time spent researching, Ythazz had committed a grievous error. He had quit watching his underlings.
Ythazz still doesn’t know who sent the golem to entrap his skull within the globe of arandur with its magic-sucking interior. Nor did he know where they transported to afterwards until recently, when the welds on the exterior of the arandur globe began to finally crack. Unfortunately, he finds himself in an area of dead magic, surrounded by numerous constructs, and enclosed within an arandur globe that is attached to a metallic clamp to the floor. Except for a few spells which he has magically “scribed” within the gems replacing his teeth, he is also without his spells. His original phylactery has been destroyed, leaving him with only the soul gems comprising his demi-lich body. However, he is not without hope. The foulness of his presence draws undead to his general area. Most are destroyed for drawing too near. However, some are intelligent enough that they have gleaned some idea of what awaits ahead. Working as his servants, they seek someone who can help them free “the dark one” from his prison, and Ythazz waits for the day that they succeed.
Ythazz Buvarr, Male Human (demi-lich template), Mulan Wiz17/RedWiz10: CR 35; Medium Undead ; HD 17d12(Wizard) , 10d12(Red Wizard) ; hp 182; Init +3; Spd 0; AC:25 (Flatfooted:24 Touch:16); Atk +12/7 base melee, +17/12 base ranged; SA: Fear Aura (Su) (DC , Paralyzing Touch (Su) , Trap the soul (Su) ,
Spell-like Abilities Planar Ally, Greater 2/day, Death Knell 27 At Will , Summon Monster I-IX At Will , Alter Self At Will , Telekinesis At Will , Dispel Magic, Greater At Will , Weird At Will , Enervation At Will , Create Undead At Will , Create Greater Undead At Will , Astral Projection At Will , Harm At Will ; SQ: Darkvision (Ex): 60 ft., Immunity: Death Effects (Ex), Immunity: Energy Drain (Ex), Immunity: Ability Drain (Ex), Immunity: Critical hits (Ex), Immunity: Stun (Ex), Immunity: Fortitude Save-Based Attacks (Ex), Immunity: Paralysis (Ex), Immunity: Reincarnate (Ex), Immunity: Raise Dead (Ex), Immunity: Sleep Effects (Ex), Immunity: Poison (Ex), Resistance: Turn (Ex): +4, Immunity: Death from Massive Damage (Ex), Damage Reduction (Su): 15/Bludgeoning and Magic, Immunity: Ability Damage (Physical Scores), Immunity: Polymorph (Ex), Racial Traits: Undead, Immunity: Cold (Ex), Immunity: Nonlethal Damage (Ex), Immunity: Electricity (Ex), Immunity: Disease (Ex), Immunity: Mind-Affecting Attacks (Ex), Resistance: Sonic (Ex): 20, Immunity: Magic (Ex), Cannot be raised; resurrection works if willing, Immunity: Ability Damage (Ex), Resistance: Acid (Ex): 20, Immunity: Subdual damage, Resistance: Fire (Ex): 20, Phylactery Transference (Su), Perfect Automatic Still Spell (Ex), Immunity: Necromancy (Ex), Negative Energy Heals (Ex), Turn resistance (Ex) +20; AL CE; SV Fort +10, Ref +13, Will +22; STR 6, DEX 16, CON --, INT 47, WIS 25, CHA 39.
Skills: Bluff +44, Concentration +30, Craft (Alchemy) +31, Craft (Calligraphy) +26, Craft (Gemcutting) +21, Craft (Poisonmaking) +23, Craft (Siege Engine) +21, Decipher Script +38, Disguise +19, Gather Information +19, Hide +34, Intimidate +46, Knowledge (Arcana) +48, Knowledge (Dragonkind) +23, Knowledge (Dreams) +19, Knowledge (Forbidden Lore) +23, Knowledge (Geography) +19, Knowledge (History) +38, Knowledge (Illithid Lore) +19, Knowledge (Local - Aglarond) +19, Knowledge (Local - Amn) +19, Knowledge (Local - Anauroch) +19, Knowledge (Local - Calimshan) +19, Knowledge (Local - Chessenta) +19, Knowledge (Local - Cormyr) +19, Knowledge (Local - Damara) +19, Knowledge (Local - Dragon Coast) +19, Knowledge (Local - Elf, Drow) +19, Knowledge (Local - Elf, Moon) +19, Knowledge (Local - Elf, Star) +19, Knowledge (Local - Elf, Sun) +19, Knowledge (Local - Gnoll) +19, Knowledge (Local - Great Dale) +19, Knowledge (Local - Great Glacier) +19, Knowledge (Local - Halruaa) +28, Knowledge (Local - High Forest) +19, Knowledge (Local - Hordelands) +19, Knowledge (Local - Impiltur) +19, Knowledge (Local - Moonsea) +19, Knowledge (Local - Mulhorand) +23, Knowledge (Local - Narfell) +28, Knowledge (Local - Nelanther Isles) +19, Knowledge (Local - Orc) +19, Knowledge (Local - Rashemen) +19, Knowledge (Local - Sembia) +19, Knowledge (Local - Tethyr) +19, Knowledge (Local - Thay) +28, Knowledge (Local - The North) +19, Knowledge (Local - The Sharr) +19, Knowledge (Local - Thesk) +19, Knowledge (Local - Underdark) +24, Knowledge (Local - Unther) +19, Knowledge (Local - Vaasa) +19, Knowledge (Local - Vihon Reach) +19, Knowledge (Local - Waterdeep) +19, Knowledge (Local - Western Heartlands) +19, Knowledge (Local - Wizards` Reach) +19, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +19, Knowledge (Psionics) +19, Knowledge (Religion) +28, Knowledge (Tactics) +23, Knowledge (The Planes) +28, Knowledge (War) +19, Listen +35, Move Silently +34, Profession (Apothecary) +8, Profession (Astrologer) +8, Profession (Bookkeeper) +8, Profession (Herbalist) +8, Profession (Lawyer) +8, Profession (Mortician) +8, Profession (Sailor) +8, Profession (Scribe) +8, Profession (Siege Engineer) +8, Profession (Tanner) +8, Profession (Torturer) +8, Search +46, Sense Motive +35, Speak Language +6, Spellcraft +90, Spot +35, Use Magic Device +24.
Feats: Automatic Quicken Spell, Automatic Still Spell, Black Lore of Moil, Blinding Speed, Corpsecrafter, Craft Wondrous Item, Destruction Retribution, Enervate Spell, Epic Spellcasting, Eschew Materials, Fell Animate, Improved Metamagic, Improved Spell Capacity: Wizard (10th), Scribe Scroll, Silent Spell, Spell Focus: Evocation, Spell Focus: Necromancy, Tattoo Focus, Tenacious Magic (ELH version), Widen Spell.
Spells Prepared (Wiz 4/9/9/8/8/8/8/7/7/7/4): .
Possessions:
Magic: Wondrous: Headband of Intellect +6 (36,000 gp); Wondrous: Cloak of Charisma +6 (36,000 gp); Wondrous: Boots of Dexterity +6 (36,000 gp); Ring: Protection +5 (50,000 gp); Ring: Spell-Battle (67,600 gp); Rod: Metamagic, Silent, Greater (24,500 gp); Wondrous: Dyrr`s Impervious Vestment (123,000 gp); Wondrous: Boots of Teleportation (49,000 gp); Wondrous: Bracers of spellcraft (+20 enhancement to spellcraft) (40,000 gp); Wondrous: Gloves of spellcraft (+20 competence to spellcraft) (40,000 gp); Wondrous: Brooch of power (5th) (25,000 gp); Wondrous: Darkskull (60,000 gp); Wondrous: Dimensional Shackles (28,000 gp); Wondrous: Ethereal Tapestry (47,520 gp); Wondrous: Gem of Seeing (75,000 gp); Wondrous: Scarf of Spellcatching (belt) (18,000 gp); Wondrous: Shackles of Silence (12,000 gp).
TACTICS: Ythazz normally heavily uses his metamagic feats, but note that due to his improved metamagic feat the number of levels that he has to raise his spells is reduced. He employs the members of his circle to add empower and/or heighten to his spells, to increase their dmg or their save DC’s. In addition, he employs his widen on area effect spells to destroy large numbers of lesser enemies, often employing fell animate to instantly turn the fallen into zombies to serve him. Note also, any undead he creates with his magic have the benefits of his corpsecrafter and destruction retribution feats applied to him (and he often employs such fodder as close support so that when they are destroyed their negative energy explosion actually heals him). Finally, Ythazz will often employ his Black Lore of Moil and enervate spell feats together with empower and maximize and heighten from his circle to create exceptionally powerful effects for use against exceptionally dangerous enemies.
|
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 22:25:09
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Ahhh interesting. The original Zulkir's.
Somehow I doubt if they have been gone this long that they are coming back or have real interest in Thay anymore. Even if they were puppet mastering for centuries, they probably would have revealed themselves when Tam's war was tearing the place apart.
But yes, certainly if a bunch of casters of that age and power suddenly came back and wanted to take over, it would give anyone pause.
Generally, it seems in the realms that the big bad's and big goods of beyond epic levels don't tangle with each other all that often. Especially in the abodes of those they are tangling with.
Actually, we do know that the original Zulkir, Ythazz Buvaar, is still around from Spellbound. He's just trapped below Bezantur. Now whether that extends the 100 years after the spellplague, can't say.
"The most powerful resident of the tombs is the ancient
Zulkir Ythazz Buvaar, one of the founders of the modem
nation of Thay. Unknown to those modem zulkirs who
have forgotten Ythazz and his contributions, the zulkir
lives on, still clinging to the elaborate throne upon
which his embalmed body once sat. He is now a demilich,
but his life force is such that he still schemes to
return and visit terrible vengeance upon those Thayans
who do not honor his memory. Currently he seeks a mortal
body to inhabit, and he sends his various minions#151;
vampires, wights, ghosts, and lesser forms of undead#151;
forth to obtain a suitable victim. So far all candidates
have proved unworthy, dying of fright or other stresses
well before Ythazz can steal their mortal bodies."
I remember that name from spellbound, although I almost forgot it. That book came out later than Ed's 1991 post about the founder "Thayd" and his cabal of Zulkir's so we can assume his name is that of the true founder since it is more recent.
Another possible tie in to this "Szass Tam was a hidden power behind the founding of Thay" which he gives us an NDA about because someone from TSR has taken that material for a story.
You're mixing up Lore. Thayd was the head of the Theurgist Adepts, which fell about two millenia prior. He was one of the last Imaskari and he challenged the Mulan Empires (specifically Mulhorand). Right after his death, the Orcgates opened.
Thayd was not a founder of Thay, but Ythazz used his name as a rememberance of the last set of non-theist magic-users to rise up against the Theocracy of Mulhorand.
I had gathered a lot of this information together in the below thread.
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6087
Note, the list of "original zulkirs" that Ed gave out at some Con years ago also disagrees with the statement in dreams of the red wizards that Jorgmacdon was the original Zulkir of Conjuration. Just a note for those doing the research. Jorgmacdon is confirmed again as being heavily involved in the freeing of Thay in Crimson Gold where they discuss Ythaaz Buvaar and his uprising. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 21:50:09
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Ahhh interesting. The original Zulkir's.
Somehow I doubt if they have been gone this long that they are coming back or have real interest in Thay anymore. Even if they were puppet mastering for centuries, they probably would have revealed themselves when Tam's war was tearing the place apart.
But yes, certainly if a bunch of casters of that age and power suddenly came back and wanted to take over, it would give anyone pause.
Generally, it seems in the realms that the big bad's and big goods of beyond epic levels don't tangle with each other all that often. Especially in the abodes of those they are tangling with.
Actually, we do know that the original Zulkir, Ythazz Buvaar, is still around from Spellbound. He's just trapped below Bezantur. Now whether that extends the 100 years after the spellplague, can't say.
"The most powerful resident of the tombs is the ancient
Zulkir Ythazz Buvaar, one of the founders of the modem
nation of Thay. Unknown to those modem zulkirs who
have forgotten Ythazz and his contributions, the zulkir
lives on, still clinging to the elaborate throne upon
which his embalmed body once sat. He is now a demilich,
but his life force is such that he still schemes to
return and visit terrible vengeance upon those Thayans
who do not honor his memory. Currently he seeks a mortal
body to inhabit, and he sends his various minions#151;
vampires, wights, ghosts, and lesser forms of undead#151;
forth to obtain a suitable victim. So far all candidates
have proved unworthy, dying of fright or other stresses
well before Ythazz can steal their mortal bodies."
I remember that name from spellbound, although I almost forgot it. That book came out later than Ed's 1991 post about the founder "Thayd" and his cabal of Zulkir's so we can assume his name is that of the true founder since it is more recent.
Another possible tie in to this "Szass Tam was a hidden power behind the founding of Thay" which he gives us an NDA about because someone from TSR has taken that material for a story. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 20:51:52
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
It's also possible Szassy has been living under a series of false names, ...
I quoted this part of the Furry Hamster's post because it reminded me of something Ed said [re: other identities Szass Tam may have had in the past], back in 2008:-
quote:
... and a certain Szass Tam (then living under another name, “Tarloth Narmandur,” and hiding much of his magical knowledge and adventurer-assembled magic items, said adventurers perishing by his hand once they brought him magic “enough” that he deemed them dangerous for what they may have held back from him) ...
I'm sure Ed could elaborate on whether this was the either one, or one of many, of Szass's past guises.
There is lore though that Szass Tam was preceded as head of the Tam family by his father Shevas Tam. Shevas was involved with the creation of the long portage. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 20:47:28
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Ahhh interesting. The original Zulkir's.
Somehow I doubt if they have been gone this long that they are coming back or have real interest in Thay anymore. Even if they were puppet mastering for centuries, they probably would have revealed themselves when Tam's war was tearing the place apart.
But yes, certainly if a bunch of casters of that age and power suddenly came back and wanted to take over, it would give anyone pause.
Generally, it seems in the realms that the big bad's and big goods of beyond epic levels don't tangle with each other all that often. Especially in the abodes of those they are tangling with.
Actually, we do know that the original Zulkir, Ythazz Buvaar, is still around from Spellbound. He's just trapped below Bezantur. Now whether that extends the 100 years after the spellplague, can't say.
"The most powerful resident of the tombs is the ancient
Zulkir Ythazz Buvaar, one of the founders of the modem
nation of Thay. Unknown to those modem zulkirs who
have forgotten Ythazz and his contributions, the zulkir
lives on, still clinging to the elaborate throne upon
which his embalmed body once sat. He is now a demilich,
but his life force is such that he still schemes to
return and visit terrible vengeance upon those Thayans
who do not honor his memory. Currently he seeks a mortal
body to inhabit, and he sends his various minions#151;
vampires, wights, ghosts, and lesser forms of undead#151;
forth to obtain a suitable victim. So far all candidates
have proved unworthy, dying of fright or other stresses
well before Ythazz can steal their mortal bodies." |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 20:41:56
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
As to Gombdalla, the last I know of her was she was arranging a controlled fey invasion of Aglarond. I'd imagine the salamander war and follow-up Tuigan invasion made her plans either run awry OR she died OR she crept behind the scenes again to be a puppetmaster pulling new strings.
It's not unusual for zulkirs to just disappear without a trace, without explanation. Such trend started in the very first Zulkirate, where almost half of the vanished, either dead or just hiding, Ed only knows. I once asked Ed what happened to those zulkirs, but apparently, it's NDA.
Actually, Gombdalla was an example of a mage who was more powerful than the current Zulkir at the time (in that instance, she was more powerful than Lauzoril). Her entry specifically noted she hadn't wanted to mess with the politics and let Lauzoril take the position, but then it noted she was now upset with her decision and was working to tear down Lauzoril. The fact that Lauzoril was still in office indicates she was not successful. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 14:20:50
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
It's also possible Szassy has been living under a series of false names, ...
I quoted this part of the Furry Hamster's post because it reminded me of something Ed said [re: other identities Szass Tam may have had in the past], back in 2008:-
quote:
... and a certain Szass Tam (then living under another name, “Tarloth Narmandur,” and hiding much of his magical knowledge and adventurer-assembled magic items, said adventurers perishing by his hand once they brought him magic “enough” that he deemed them dangerous for what they may have held back from him) ...
I'm sure Ed could elaborate on whether this was the either one, or one of many, of Szass's past guises.
|
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 14:00:52
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Just a feeling? Or you really know it straight from Ed?
Szass Tam was born prior to what's been stated in the sourcebooks, and he was part of or behind the establishment of the very first Zulkirate...Just the sound of it makes him twice the powerful and cunning lich we've known him as.
Or it might simply explain his vast power compared to other Zulkirs. getting to his level in only a few hundred years is a pretty big accomplishment. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 07:41:55
Just a feeling? Or you really know it straight from Ed?
Szass Tam was born prior to what's been stated in the sourcebooks, and he was part of or behind the establishment of the very first Zulkirate...Just the sound of it makes him twice the powerful and cunning lich we've known him as. |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 06:10:16
Yes, I have a feeling that "Szass Tam born in 1104 DR" is not actually that at all.
-- George Krashos
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 04:28:19
Szassy could have pulled a Khelben Arunsun... The Blackstaff swapped places with his grandson of the same name, so everyone thinks he's a lot younger than he actually is...
It's also possible Szassy has been living under a series of false names, and this is simply the latest one. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 03:35:15
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Ah. But haven't you yourself said you didn't expect Lord Shadow to come out years after the publication of Netheril: Empire of Magic? And look at what he's become now... One of the biggest threats in Faerun...
So, those who lurk might ONE day emerge...
Heh. Just from digging in that thread makes me nerd giddy, as it seems Ed has hinted that Szass Tam was a hidden power in the founding of the Zulkirate/Red wizards from the get go.
Sadly, the hooded one also said NDA because someone from TSR took the info on Tam's untold tales from his early days for a project way back when and has not yet relinquished it, and said not to get our hopes up over it :(
For all we know, Szass Tam might have been Tarabbas Mroound lol
Actually, no. Szass Tam was born on 1104 DR, and attained lichdom on 1159 DR. The First Zulkirate was formed years before that: 1030 DR.
I know what the sourcebook says about his date of birth.
And yet, Ed has thrown the idea out there with the pre-Zulkir Thay that Tam was around and indicated he was a hidden power behind the organization since its inception. A few words about Szass and Thayd and a lot of NDA
On occasion I wish this site had a chatroom :p
I have a feeling we could have some good live discussions:p |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 03:01:01
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Ah. But haven't you yourself said you didn't expect Lord Shadow to come out years after the publication of Netheril: Empire of Magic? And look at what he's become now... One of the biggest threats in Faerun...
So, those who lurk might ONE day emerge...
Heh. Just from digging in that thread makes me nerd giddy, as it seems Ed has hinted that Szass Tam was a hidden power in the founding of the Zulkirate/Red wizards from the get go.
Sadly, the hooded one also said NDA because someone from TSR took the info on Tam's untold tales from his early days for a project way back when and has not yet relinquished it, and said not to get our hopes up over it :(
For all we know, Szass Tam might have been Tarabbas Mroound lol
Actually, no. Szass Tam was born on 1104 DR, and attained lichdom on 1159 DR. The First Zulkirate was formed years before that: 1030 DR. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:40:59
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Ah. But haven't you yourself said you didn't expect Lord Shadow to come out years after the publication of Netheril: Empire of Magic? And look at what he's become now... One of the biggest threats in Faerun...
So, those who lurk might ONE day emerge...
Heh. Just from digging in that thread makes me nerd giddy, as it seems Ed has hinted that Szass Tam was a hidden power in the founding of the Zulkirate/Red wizards from the get go.
Sadly, the hooded one also said NDA because someone from TSR took the info on Tam's untold tales from his early days for a project way back when and has not yet relinquished it, and said not to get our hopes up over it :(
For all we know, Szass Tam might have been Tarabbas Mroound lol |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:33:33
Ah. But haven't you yourself said you didn't expect Lord Shadow to come out years after the publication of Netheril: Empire of Magic? And look at what he's become now... One of the biggest threats in Faerun...
So, those who lurk might ONE day emerge... |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:25:59
Ahhh interesting. The original Zulkir's.
Somehow I doubt if they have been gone this long that they are coming back or have real interest in Thay anymore. Even if they were puppet mastering for centuries, they probably would have revealed themselves when Tam's war was tearing the place apart.
But yes, certainly if a bunch of casters of that age and power suddenly came back and wanted to take over, it would give anyone pause.
Generally, it seems in the realms that the big bad's and big goods of beyond epic levels don't tangle with each other all that often. Especially in the abodes of those they are tangling with. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:18:57
Yes. You can read it here. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:13:13
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Tarabbas Mroound alone is enough to make Szass Tam pause a little. And there's Hahlomede Teeos, who's probably the greatest Abjurer in all of Toril.
I suppose since I have never heard of them in any sourcebook or novel, I have no way of knowing. I am assuming Ed mentioned them somewhere? |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 02:02:05
Tarabbas Mroound alone is enough to make Szass Tam pause a little. And there's Hahlomede Teeos, who's probably the greatest Abjurer in all of Toril. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 01:38:21
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
If anything, those vanished zulkirs are like a beacon of hope for those who love the Old Thay. Their combined firepower might be more than enough to overthrow Szass Tam, if they're really serious about it.
Heh. I dunno. It would have to be a lot of them and they would need to find significant economic and military might just to get to him.
He quickly squashed 4 Zulkir's who had 3 capable minions in 7 vs 1 combat.
I often wondered if Undead could soil themselves, and figured I would find out since Szass Tam's rival became a exarch level god of undead.
|
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 00:55:12
If anything, those vanished zulkirs are like a beacon of hope for those who love the Old Thay. Their combined firepower might be more than enough to overthrow Szass Tam, if they're really serious about it. |
| Firestorm |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 00:50:51
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
As to Gombdalla, the last I know of her was she was arranging a controlled fey invasion of Aglarond. I'd imagine the salamander war and follow-up Tuigan invasion made her plans either run awry OR she died OR she crept behind the scenes again to be a puppetmaster pulling new strings.
It's not unusual for zulkirs to just disappear without a trace, without explanation. Such trend started in the very first Zulkirate, where almost half of the vanished, either dead or just hiding, Ed only knows. I once asked Ed what happened to those zulkirs, but apparently, it's NDA.
NDA is often the best way to go :)
Leaves much open for gamer use. In a mission in Thay, were the players in need of Magical aid of the highest level, I could introduce them to a shadowy organization in Pyarados with a grudge against the Zulkir of Enchantment led by a shadowy figure, who will have their aid one way or the other :p
If the players decide against working with her, I would merely offer dozens of magical items and proof of her good will towards them. Once whatever the mission they were on is complete, her spell will end and they will realize that she never made those promises and they were in fact all enchanted into doing her bidding, although they may have picked up a nice item or two along the way that breaks or protects against enchantment.
Sets up a nice grudge against a powerful foe, and the next quest, I know they are going to be looking into finding more protections against enchantments :)
In any case, we usually find out what becomes of them an edition down the road. Hell, I never expected to hear of "lord Shadow" again after they moved to the demiplane of shadow "forever", but I managed to use it in some of my quests when I wanted to give my higher level players some netherese items......And down the road, I got some nice new info and great books when Ed decided what to do with them for real :p |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 Nov 2012 : 00:05:43
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
As to Gombdalla, the last I know of her was she was arranging a controlled fey invasion of Aglarond. I'd imagine the salamander war and follow-up Tuigan invasion made her plans either run awry OR she died OR she crept behind the scenes again to be a puppetmaster pulling new strings.
It's not unusual for zulkirs to just disappear without a trace, without explanation. Such trend started in the very first Zulkirate, where almost half of the vanished, either dead or just hiding, Ed only knows. I once asked Ed what happened to those zulkirs, but apparently, it's NDA. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 12 Nov 2012 : 18:54:09
quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
Would a Red Wizard still be a Red Wizard if they donned a Helmet of Alignment Change and went to a Good alignment?
Not according to the prestige class
They only need to be evil to qualify to gain the prestige class...from a rules standpoint I see your argument on that matter. However, once they are IN...they wouldn't fail to have access to their abilities if their alignment was changed would they?
technically, yes. If you no longer qualify for a prestige class' entry requirements, then you're supposed to lose all abilities (similar to feats). That being said, I once wrote up an NPC based off the Damaran based "twilight rider", Myrddin Viligoth, who was noted as being an ex-red wizard who had turned to the worship of Ilmater. So, for me story always comes first, and unless there is an obvious reason that alignment change would cause them to lose access to abilities... I don't force the issue. For instance, if a blackguard turns good, yeah, he'd lose his abilities. If a Hathran turned evil, the spirits of the land would quit working with her unless she turned Durthan, etc....
If you're interested in seeing the Myrddin build/story, its here.
http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7576 |
| Dalor Darden |
Posted - 12 Nov 2012 : 15:45:00
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
Would a Red Wizard still be a Red Wizard if they donned a Helmet of Alignment Change and went to a Good alignment?
Not according to the prestige class
They only need to be evil to qualify to gain the prestige class...from a rules standpoint I see your argument on that matter. However, once they are IN...they wouldn't fail to have access to their abilities if their alignment was changed would they? |
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