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Vikramaditya
Acolyte
15 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 20:51:04
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Greetings to all,
I’ve recently read the tomes “Cormanthyr – Empire of the Elves” and “Fall of Myth Drannor”, and was hoping some of the learned scribes here could answer a question I had about the Old Elven Court. In “Fall of Myth Drannor” we are told that:
1. The Elves and Dark Elves work together by necessity against the army of darkness, clearing the old elven court of drow gates and beasts in the process.
2. Just prior to the fall of Myth Drannor, 12 high mages come together to create a mythal around the old elven court, sublimating their essence into the highfire crown in the process..
3. During the final battles for Myth Drannor, many elves retreat to the mythal of the elven court, which is once again an exclusively elven preserve..
4. The Myth Drannor mythal is badly tainted in the final fall, preventing flight, among other effects..
5. After the Final Fall, elves create Elventree to create a base for interaction with the non-elven communities, while they retreat to the Elven Court (and Semberholme?..or do all elves leave the rest of Cormanthyr for the Elven court?)
Based on the FRCS and Lords of Darkness, it would appear that there is no sizable elven community in Cormanthyr at present, and the main inhabitants near the old elven court are drow from House Jaerle (sp?) who are trying to research and pervert the mythal to create a new drow city above ground..
My questions are FR timeline related, and are as follows:
1. What happens to the Mythal in Myth Drannor itself? Is it broken/completely corrupted in the Final Fall? Could it be restored ?
2. How did the mythal at the Elven court get corrupted, and the Elven court become empty in less than one generation of elves? Did the elves just abandon their city and leave for evermeet on the retreat, or did other factors hasten their departure?
3. Are there any published works I could read regarding the cleansing of the ruins of Myth Drannor of fiends, and specifically about the Knights of Myth Drannor, as they appear to play a major part in this?
Many thanks for your insights into my questions. I’ve found some of the answers I seek on other scrolls in Candlekeep, specifically http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1577&SearchTerms=elven+court, but could not find everything I seek..
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 21:39:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
3. Are there any published works I could read regarding the cleansing of the ruins of Myth Drannor of fiends, and specifically about the Knights of Myth Drannor, as they appear to play a major part in this?
Ed Greenwood is currently writing a novel that will feature the KoMD in a new tale. No idea if Myth Drannor will be covered, but it might be something to look forward to. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36779 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 22:38:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
Greetings to all,
I’ve recently read the tomes “Cormanthyr – Empire of the Elves” and “Fall of Myth Drannor”, and was hoping some of the learned scribes here could answer a question I had about the Old Elven Court. In “Fall of Myth Drannor” we are told that:
1. The Elves and Dark Elves work together by necessity against the army of darkness, clearing the old elven court of drow gates and beasts in the process.
Nah, the drow had been banished long before then -- millennia before. I could be mistaken, but I'm certain that no drow were present in Myth Drannor before its fall.
quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
4. The Myth Drannor mythal is badly tainted in the final fall, preventing flight, among other effects..
It may have been damaged in the Fall, but that's not the whole of it. It's been centuries since then, and there's been lots of extra-planar baddies wandering around, corrupting it further. Plus, the nature of the mythal was such that it would decay over time. No one has maintained it.
quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
1. What happens to the Mythal in Myth Drannor itself? Is it broken/completely corrupted in the Final Fall? Could it be restored ?
Well, considering that the one over Evereska was badly damaged and then restored, I'd say yes, it could be restored. But first, you've got to cleanse the ruins, and that's a tall order.
As for how much was done during the Fall, I'd think that it was damaged, but it could have been fixed, had there remained elves to fix it. There wasn't, and then all the baddies came in and messed it up further...
quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
3. Are there any published works I could read regarding the cleansing of the ruins of Myth Drannor of fiends, and specifically about the Knights of Myth Drannor, as they appear to play a major part in this?
They've done their part, certainly, but so have many others.
As for as how much the Knights have done, Ed has not yet revealed that to us. Though I do recall a reference or to of a portal to the Lower Planes that all these baddies were coming thru, until the Knights destroyed it.
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 26 Jun 2004 00:54:41 |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 02:49:45
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The reference to that portal is correct Wooly. There's been several sources (both 2e and 3e) that mention that particular detail.
Does anyone know which lower plane it connected to? I recall that in the 2e material it says the Abyss, but surely that would be different now given the current FR cosmology?
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 03:05:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
The reference to that portal is correct Wooly. There's been several sources (both 2e and 3e) that mention that particular detail.
Does anyone know which lower plane it connected to? I recall that in the 2e material it says the Abyss, but surely that would be different now given the current FR cosmology?
Why? The Abyss still exists........ |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 03:07:28
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Yes, I know. But don't the Tanar'ri now inhabit more than just one plane in this new cosmology?
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 04:07:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Kazandra
Yes, I know. But don't the Tanar'ri now inhabit more than just one plane in this new cosmology?
Mostly the Abyss, the same as they did in the Wheel/Ring.... Like that cosmology they could move around though...... |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6643 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 07:46:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
1. What happens to the Mythal in Myth Drannor itself? Is it broken/completely corrupted in the Final Fall? Could it be restored ?
It is corrupted but still in effect - although the 3E Realms makes it sound like they want it decaying at an accelerated rate. The best way to see what has happened to it in the 650 or so years since the fall of Myth Drannor is to compare the mythal powers in "Cormanthyr" to the mythal powers in the old "Ruins of Myth Drannor" boxed set.
quote:
2. How did the mythal at the Elven court get corrupted, and the Elven court become empty in less than one generation of elves? Did the elves just abandon their city and leave for evermeet on the retreat, or did other factors hasten their departure?
The mythal at Elven Court is not corrupted. It still works just fine. This really hasn't been dealt with in the published Realms unfortunately - we don't know what the Retreat (beginning in 1344 DR) did in terms of the elven population of Elven Court. My feel would be that an elite force of elves continues to populate Elven Court, using magic and deception to ward of interlopers - including the drow and humans of Sembia.
quote:
3. Are there any published works I could read regarding the cleansing of the ruins of Myth Drannor of fiends, and specifically about the Knights of Myth Drannor, as they appear to play a major part in this?
As someone else pointed out - hopefully Ed's novel trilogy on the Knights of Myth Drannor will shed some light on this. The aforementioned "Ruins of Myth Drannor" boxed set touches on this but there are some peculiar inconsistencies - like why the encounter tables include demons. The Army of Darkness was made up of yugoloths and the Zhents summoned the devils - just where did the demons come from? (I think that the ruins of Myth Drannor shouldn't actually have demons, just devils and some stray yugoloths - the feel from the novel "The Temptation of Elminster" is how I see Myth Drannor as an adventuring site.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 10:53:10
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
As someone else pointed out - hopefully Ed's novel trilogy on the Knights of Myth Drannor will shed some light on this. The aforementioned "Ruins of Myth Drannor" boxed set touches on this but there are some peculiar inconsistencies - like why the encounter tables include demons. The Army of Darkness was made up of yugoloths and the Zhents summoned the devils - just where did the demons come from? (I think that the ruins of Myth Drannor shouldn't actually have demons, just devils and some stray yugoloths - the feel from the novel "The Temptation of Elminster" is how I see Myth Drannor as an adventuring site.
That's something I also wondered about. I mean, even in early days of 2e there was a clear delineation between fiends from the Abyss and fiends from the Nine Hells.
I suppose it's possible (and in keeping with the yugoloth mindset) that the yugoloths could have formulated a strategy to bring (or rather bribe) the tanar'ri into the Army of Darkness. They are the master manipulators on the planes afterall . . . 
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 19:34:23
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
quote:
Originally posted by Vikramaditya
[quote]2. How did the mythal at the Elven court get corrupted, and the Elven court become empty in less than one generation of elves? Did the elves just abandon their city and leave for evermeet on the retreat, or did other factors hasten their departure?
The mythal at Elven Court is not corrupted. It still works just fine. This really hasn't been dealt with in the published Realms unfortunately - we don't know what the Retreat (beginning in 1344 DR) did in terms of the elven population of Elven Court. My feel would be that an elite force of elves continues to populate Elven Court, using magic and deception to ward of interlopers - including the drow and humans of Sembia.
-- George Krashos
Interesting... I had been a bit annoyed at the 3e treatment of Cormanthyr - it had so little left of the feel presented in Cormanthyr and tFoMD. I thought that at least some elves should still reside there, but it appeared they did not. I'm glad for a second opinion that they do. |
Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6643 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jun 2004 : 02:40:51
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I personally never "dug" the surface drow invasion of Cormanthyr - especially considering they used High Forest surface-dwelling drow. There wasn't any real hard evidence that there were significant surface drow inhabiting the High Forest - but given that Menzo and Ched Nasad are in the vicinity (and sell novels), I guess this was the easiest way to go.
If they'd used the surface drow from the Forest of Mir (detailed in LOI and EotSS) then they'd at least have a reason as to why they left their homes - persecution by the drow of Guallidurth etc. Of course, if the motivator was to get to the mythal, then the Mir drow have more mythals (Myth Rhynn, Myth Lharast, Myth Unnohyr) in their general vicinity than anyone - so why would they trek halfway across Faerun ....?
But heck, we've got Vhaerun-worshipping drow in Cormanthor now - we'll just have to live with it.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2066 Posts |
Posted - 27 Jun 2004 : 12:45:23
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| There were a few drow dwelling in the High Forest, according to "The North", but those drow were fairly well accounted for in Elaine's "Daughter of the Drow." In my campaign, I simply attribute them to Maerimydran expatriates and it works much better for me. |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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The Second Fall of the Elven Court
